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[Music]

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welcome to the skeptic zone

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the podcast from australia for science

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and reason

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[Music]

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yes it's the skeptic zone podcast

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episode number 650

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good grief 650 for the 28th of march

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2021 richard saunders coming to you from

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sydney australia which

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is like most of new south wales and

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parts of queensland drying

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out from the flood emergency disaster

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that was last week

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although of course not completely over

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many areas are still affected by the

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floods

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which were described at various times as

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once in 50 years once in a hundred years

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once in a generation

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they were quite big floods coming up on

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today's show

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the 650th time the skeptic zone has been

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produced

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or more or less because i did a few sort

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of funny specials early on with

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videos and whatever but let's call it

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650.

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i speak to an old friend of mine doctor

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siobhan o'sullivan

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who has a very important message and

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story to tell

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about her plight with ovarian cancer

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now siobhan's attitude is

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uh remarkable admirable she is such a

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sunny

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positive person

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but her situation is of course serious i

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think you will find this

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interview with siobhan very interesting

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and moving and more important she has

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some uh

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very good information to uh tell you all

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and at the end of the show i will give a

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few more thoughts about my interview

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with uh dr

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siobhan o'sullivan coming up after that

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it's the last part of our three-part

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interview with dr brad mackay

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maynard talks to bad about biocharges

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solariums and the importance of getting

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a second opinion then to round off the

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show we dive once more into trove to

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look for references to the great harry

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houdini

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especially his exploits his adventures

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here in australia

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where he is in some quarters credited as

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the first man to fly an aircraft in

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australia

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that is disputed it seems likely he was

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amongst the first men to

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fly an aircraft here in australia but

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nevertheless some interesting reports

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from around 1910

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so no matter what you're doing if you're

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driving along listening to the show if

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you're out jogging or walking

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like i like to do long walks listening

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to various podcasts

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if you're doing chores around the house

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oh yes the dreaded vacuuming

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cleaning up the kitchen ironing you know

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that sort of thing

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i hope you enjoyed this week's episode

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of the show but now it's time for me to

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run downstairs no waffles but i will

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have a pancake or three

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and some maple syrup while i do that i

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[Applause]

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[Music]

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do

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[Music]

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oh he's already out i'm here with

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siobhan and solomon and dr

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tomtom's to his friends mister when he's

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being a bit more formal

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but he's in his tuxedo so he's always

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he's coming to investigate all the setup

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here

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he should just have a sniff and not be

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of any problem

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well i'm i'm here with dr siobhan

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siobhan uh now we haven't seen each

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other for a while we caught up last week

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and skeptic's own listeners might be

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interested to know that i

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interviewed you six years ago

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doesn't time fly awesome time fly about

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your podcast

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knowing animals and we met not long

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before that at a podcast meetup group

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here in sydney now i've come over to

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have a chat with you today because

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since those days your life especially in

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the last six

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seven months is completely

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and utterly changed so

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in your own words yes so it was

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uh during the pandemic so it was 2020

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uh and around the middle of the year

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uh in kind of mid-july

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i started to feel a little bit not so

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good

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so i had a period of about two weeks

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where i was going around saying to

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people

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i don't feel quite right i don't know

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what's wrong

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i think i'm just stressed and my father

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was very ill at the time

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and he was he would die actually very

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soon after this

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and so i just put it down to

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circumstance

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i was feeling a little bit bloated in my

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mid

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normal

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but it was covered and i wasn't getting

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dressed in my normal work clothes i was

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in more inactive wear

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and i just thought i've put on a little

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bit of weight

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and i'm feeling a bit stressed because

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my father's so sick

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um and then after about two weeks

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of that i really felt terrible i did go

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to my gp

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and the first thing the gp said to me

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was that it's probably constipation and

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i should go away and take a whole lot of

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laxatives etc

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so actually did do that for three days

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just felt worse and worse every day

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so then i went back to the gp and i said

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look it's clearly not constipation

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and the gp said uh look it could be a

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whole range of different things we're

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going to start

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off assuming the worst and test for the

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worst

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and then hopefully we just landed being

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something simple or relatively simple

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such as irritable bowel etc

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so they took my bloods i i came back

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home actually to where we are right now

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and

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then after a couple of hours my gp rang

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me and said

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a particular marker in the blood that is

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an indication of cancer

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in my case was extremely elevated and

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that i should go

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to rpa which is the local hospital

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public hospital here in sydney's inner

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west

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i should go to rpa royal prince alford

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right away

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and he also said what's wrong with you

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is something very serious

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i don't know what it is but it's

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something very serious say pack a bag

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because they're not going to let you go

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until they work out what the problem is

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so i went there to rpa

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for people who know it it is a very very

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old hospital

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yeah my view it's a hospital that's in

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need of a lot of investment

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um so its emergency room is not a

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pleasant place to be

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particularly during covert where

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everyone was in mass and

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you could only have certain people in

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the room etc etc

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when i got there um i did tell them

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about this marker in my blood being very

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elevated

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and i think that they were doubtful um

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about how elevated it was because this

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particular indicator is

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meant to sit um kind of around 15

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and when i went to rpa it was about 280

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wow and it got up to 490

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and so um the first thing they said is

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that it may well be appendicitis

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uh and then they did a cat scan ct scan

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and once they did they could see

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that in actual fact it was ovarian

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cancer so i was diagnosed then

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and that evening i was moved

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over to chris o'brien lifehouse which is

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a fantastic

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cancer hospital here in sydney

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uh that was probably one of the best

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things that's happened to me since this

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all started is discovering that this

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world-class cancer hospital is right on

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my

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to all the people living in rural and

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regional australia who

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you know don't have access to places

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like chris o'brien lifehouse

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so i went there and then um i just

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from that point in time started to

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really learn you know

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what was happening to me i knew precious

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little about ovarian cancer

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i'd never really thought about it i

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didn't realize how serious what serious

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it is

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but of course i quickly became became

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educated at that time

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yeah and what month was that when that

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was in august that was the very

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beginning of august 2020

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not long ago not long ago uh

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one of the amazing things for me and i

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think of my

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friends and family is that even though

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it was you know six seven months ago

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that i was diagnosed

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the cancer has become absolutely

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overwhelming it's kind of the

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most important narrative here we are

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having this incredibly

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serious conversation and the cat has

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jumped up right between us

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he's checking everything out my my

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um one of my cats tom tom he is a very

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naughty boy but so far he's just

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sniffing he's not actually

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taking anything apart so we can be

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grateful

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so i'm sorry to interrupt you there but

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the cat's just left up right right up

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here

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so that yes the the light life house

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it's called

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house it's a specialist cancer

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hospital it's world-class and

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just i've not had a huge amount of luck

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with this whole cancer thing including

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actually contracting it because it is a

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very

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uh rare cancer and i got it extremely

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young

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yeah but in the midst of a great deal of

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bad luck

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one good thing that has happened to me

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is that i happen to live very close to

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this world-class

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cancer hospital now you in our

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conversation before he's going for the

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microphone look at that

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he's just having a little sniff so far

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i'm watching you tom thomas

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[Laughter]

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he's completely destroying the

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atmosphere of the interview but that's

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sort of okay

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so um yes now when we met last week for

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a coffee and you were

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explaining the situation a little bit

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more fully to me you were saying how

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important it is

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uh for you now to really

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help educate other women as to this uh

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to this cancer yeah it is it is a

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priority for me

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to to speak out and to raise awareness

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i when i think about the moment i was

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diagnosed

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i just knew nothing and part of the

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reason i knew nothing was because

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00:11:36,550 --> 00:11:34,640
i'd never known anyone who had ovarian

287
00:11:38,949 --> 00:11:36,560
cancer

288
00:11:41,430 --> 00:11:38,959
but also there just isn't the community

289
00:11:42,710 --> 00:11:41,440
education and awareness that i think we

290
00:11:44,710 --> 00:11:42,720
have developed

291
00:11:46,949 --> 00:11:44,720
in relation to things such as breast

292
00:11:49,269 --> 00:11:46,959
cancer and skin cancer and prostate

293
00:11:52,710 --> 00:11:49,279
cancer and things like that

294
00:11:55,430 --> 00:11:52,720
people just simply do not know

295
00:11:57,910 --> 00:11:55,440
and my friends and family have all been

296
00:12:01,350 --> 00:11:57,920
shocked by everything that's happened

297
00:12:04,069 --> 00:12:01,360
uh many people i know have been

298
00:12:05,750 --> 00:12:04,079
off to have themselves tested because it

299
00:12:07,269 --> 00:12:05,760
just makes you realize goodness what's

300
00:12:10,150 --> 00:12:07,279
going on in my body

301
00:12:12,870 --> 00:12:10,160
so there is a real absence of

302
00:12:16,310 --> 00:12:12,880
understanding about ovarian cancer

303
00:12:17,750 --> 00:12:16,320
and at this point in time the primary

304
00:12:21,110 --> 00:12:17,760
tool we have

305
00:12:21,430 --> 00:12:21,120
to deal with cancer is to get onto it

306
00:12:26,069 --> 00:12:21,440
early

307
00:12:27,190 --> 00:12:26,079
treatment as soon as you start trying to

308
00:12:29,910 --> 00:12:27,200
address it

309
00:12:30,310 --> 00:12:29,920
the greater your chances of success and

310
00:12:34,150 --> 00:12:30,320
that

311
00:12:36,470 --> 00:12:34,160
is why ovarian cancer is so insidious

312
00:12:38,470 --> 00:12:36,480
because when people are diagnosed or

313
00:12:40,790 --> 00:12:38,480
women are diagnosed they're typically

314
00:12:43,190 --> 00:12:40,800
either stage three or stage four

315
00:12:44,069 --> 00:12:43,200
and that's very late to be diagnosed so

316
00:12:47,750 --> 00:12:44,079
you can

317
00:12:50,230 --> 00:12:47,760
and it was the case with you it was

318
00:12:53,110 --> 00:12:50,240
in you you had it but you had no idea i

319
00:12:56,310 --> 00:12:53,120
had absolutely no idea whatsoever

320
00:12:59,590 --> 00:12:56,320
when i was diagnosed i was stage three

321
00:13:01,829 --> 00:12:59,600
which is a blessing um stage

322
00:13:03,670 --> 00:13:01,839
four means that the cancer has spread

323
00:13:07,269 --> 00:13:03,680
from the primary location to

324
00:13:08,310 --> 00:13:07,279
other another part of the body so in my

325
00:13:12,069 --> 00:13:08,320
case the cancer

326
00:13:15,910 --> 00:13:12,079
was still contained within my abdomen

327
00:13:17,910 --> 00:13:15,920
so i was very fortunate in that regard

328
00:13:19,030 --> 00:13:17,920
one of the things about ovarian cancer

329
00:13:22,710 --> 00:13:19,040
however that is

330
00:13:26,550 --> 00:13:22,720
just so disappointing and frustrating

331
00:13:27,670 --> 00:13:26,560
is that it is this this creeping silent

332
00:13:32,870 --> 00:13:27,680
cancer

333
00:13:34,949 --> 00:13:32,880
but also it does develop very quickly

334
00:13:37,190 --> 00:13:34,959
so there's no way of really knowing for

335
00:13:38,310 --> 00:13:37,200
sure when i would have first had that

336
00:13:41,110 --> 00:13:38,320
cancer

337
00:13:42,310 --> 00:13:41,120
but i did ask my surgeon about it and

338
00:13:45,350 --> 00:13:42,320
she said it's

339
00:13:47,110 --> 00:13:45,360
feasible that i wouldn't have had the

340
00:13:50,069 --> 00:13:47,120
cancer at all

341
00:13:52,230 --> 00:13:50,079
um at the start of 2020 and she said

342
00:13:52,949 --> 00:13:52,240
she's seen people who within six months

343
00:13:55,829 --> 00:13:52,959
have

344
00:13:56,550 --> 00:13:55,839
gone from having completely clear scans

345
00:13:59,110 --> 00:13:56,560
to

346
00:14:00,310 --> 00:13:59,120
uh being in the situation i was in which

347
00:14:04,790 --> 00:14:00,320
is what they call

348
00:14:09,829 --> 00:14:08,389
very nice it's a very it's a wonderful

349
00:14:11,910 --> 00:14:09,839
expression

350
00:14:13,750 --> 00:14:11,920
so yeah this is one of the worries it

351
00:14:16,870 --> 00:14:13,760
goes very very quickly

352
00:14:21,189 --> 00:14:16,880
it's a um it's a real monster yeah

353
00:14:24,710 --> 00:14:21,199
wow very very diseased yeah

354
00:14:27,990 --> 00:14:27,670
now um one of the things too that we

355
00:14:30,790 --> 00:14:28,000
might

356
00:14:32,629 --> 00:14:30,800
touch on because obviously this is the

357
00:14:33,829 --> 00:14:32,639
skeptic zone podcast and we do look at

358
00:14:35,990 --> 00:14:33,839
these issues

359
00:14:37,590 --> 00:14:36,000
is that an and i know what happens to

360
00:14:39,189 --> 00:14:37,600
other people is when you're

361
00:14:42,150 --> 00:14:39,199
diagnosed with something like cancer you

362
00:14:45,189 --> 00:14:42,160
get a wide range of people

363
00:14:45,990 --> 00:14:45,199
and to be fair as possible probably well

364
00:14:49,030 --> 00:14:46,000
meaning

365
00:14:52,150 --> 00:14:49,040
giving you all sorts of advice yes

366
00:14:55,269 --> 00:14:52,160
absolutely yeah so i have

367
00:14:57,750 --> 00:14:55,279
experienced that and it has been

368
00:14:59,269 --> 00:14:57,760
one of the really interesting phenomenon

369
00:15:02,470 --> 00:14:59,279
that i've observed

370
00:15:06,550 --> 00:15:02,480
since i've been sick i

371
00:15:10,310 --> 00:15:06,560
have in a sense been on the

372
00:15:11,350 --> 00:15:10,320
front foot so the the way i've decided

373
00:15:15,030 --> 00:15:11,360
to deal with this

374
00:15:18,150 --> 00:15:15,040
is to be open up front

375
00:15:20,310 --> 00:15:18,160
transparent with people to communicate

376
00:15:24,230 --> 00:15:20,320
widely to people what's happening

377
00:15:26,230 --> 00:15:24,240
because i think it's easier than perhaps

378
00:15:28,550 --> 00:15:26,240
you know allowing people to to talk

379
00:15:28,949 --> 00:15:28,560
among themselves i think it is better to

380
00:15:31,189 --> 00:15:28,959
be

381
00:15:32,550 --> 00:15:31,199
um transparent and communicate what's

382
00:15:36,150 --> 00:15:32,560
going on yeah yeah

383
00:15:37,749 --> 00:15:36,160
um so everyone kind of knew very quickly

384
00:15:40,629 --> 00:15:37,759
what was happening

385
00:15:42,230 --> 00:15:40,639
but then what i observed was that people

386
00:15:45,350 --> 00:15:42,240
were coming to me

387
00:15:48,470 --> 00:15:45,360
with suggestions of uh

388
00:15:50,230 --> 00:15:48,480
cures or treatments or ways of managing

389
00:15:52,870 --> 00:15:50,240
ovarian cancer

390
00:15:53,910 --> 00:15:52,880
um the people that were doing this were

391
00:15:56,550 --> 00:15:53,920
people who were

392
00:15:57,350 --> 00:15:56,560
not medically trained in any way shape

393
00:16:00,629 --> 00:15:57,360
or form

394
00:16:04,310 --> 00:16:00,639
so not medical doctors not nurses not

395
00:16:06,949 --> 00:16:04,320
um anyone working in allied

396
00:16:08,550 --> 00:16:06,959
kind of certified allied professions

397
00:16:10,069 --> 00:16:08,560
these were people who were completely

398
00:16:12,870 --> 00:16:10,079
removed from that world

399
00:16:13,829 --> 00:16:12,880
but wanted to convey to me that they

400
00:16:17,430 --> 00:16:13,839
knew

401
00:16:18,389 --> 00:16:17,440
how to help heal me wow now in some

402
00:16:22,150 --> 00:16:18,399
cases

403
00:16:25,189 --> 00:16:22,160
the the proposed treatments were rather

404
00:16:28,550 --> 00:16:25,199
uh i guess bizarre but not

405
00:16:29,509 --> 00:16:28,560
really um kind of invasive like there

406
00:16:31,990 --> 00:16:29,519
are things that i

407
00:16:34,069 --> 00:16:32,000
i could imagine you might do i couldn't

408
00:16:36,629 --> 00:16:34,079
really imagine that there's

409
00:16:38,470 --> 00:16:36,639
any evidence that they're effective but

410
00:16:39,110 --> 00:16:38,480
they were things like eating certain

411
00:16:42,150 --> 00:16:39,120
types of

412
00:16:45,829 --> 00:16:42,160
vegetables or fruits or some other

413
00:16:49,189 --> 00:16:45,839
strange thing in in whatever combination

414
00:16:52,069 --> 00:16:49,199
i also had one person approach me

415
00:16:54,629 --> 00:16:52,079
saying that they were able to heal me

416
00:16:56,230 --> 00:16:54,639
but it would require me to divulge

417
00:16:58,710 --> 00:16:56,240
a considerable amount of personal

418
00:17:00,790 --> 00:16:58,720
information about myself

419
00:17:02,550 --> 00:17:00,800
that conversation didn't get any further

420
00:17:05,350 --> 00:17:02,560
than that

421
00:17:07,669 --> 00:17:05,360
my intuition is that the information was

422
00:17:08,870 --> 00:17:07,679
perhaps going to be of a sexual nature i

423
00:17:11,750 --> 00:17:08,880
wasn't sure

424
00:17:12,630 --> 00:17:11,760
but what i have been saying to all the

425
00:17:16,549 --> 00:17:12,640
people who

426
00:17:19,909 --> 00:17:16,559
are approaching me with non-um

427
00:17:21,990 --> 00:17:19,919
scientifically confirmed treatments is

428
00:17:24,069 --> 00:17:22,000
i've decided to go with traditional

429
00:17:27,110 --> 00:17:24,079
medicine

430
00:17:28,549 --> 00:17:27,120
my view is that at life house for

431
00:17:31,590 --> 00:17:28,559
example

432
00:17:35,510 --> 00:17:31,600
they are open-minded

433
00:17:39,110 --> 00:17:35,520
in terms of facilitating

434
00:17:40,150 --> 00:17:39,120
complementary medicines of to some

435
00:17:43,110 --> 00:17:40,160
extent

436
00:17:43,990 --> 00:17:43,120
so for example they have dietitians on

437
00:17:45,630 --> 00:17:44,000
staff

438
00:17:47,510 --> 00:17:45,640
they even have for example

439
00:17:50,590 --> 00:17:47,520
reflexologists oh well

440
00:17:51,830 --> 00:17:50,600
yeah so they they have acupuncture

441
00:17:55,669 --> 00:17:51,840
reflexologists

442
00:17:58,789 --> 00:17:55,679
and um exercise physiologists so they do

443
00:17:59,430 --> 00:17:58,799
offer some degree of complementary

444
00:18:03,510 --> 00:17:59,440
medicine

445
00:18:04,390 --> 00:18:03,520
at lifehouse but it is supervised by

446
00:18:07,990 --> 00:18:04,400
someone who

447
00:18:11,909 --> 00:18:08,000
is a medical professional and

448
00:18:15,430 --> 00:18:11,919
it is never for example

449
00:18:17,350 --> 00:18:15,440
intended to replace or undermine or

450
00:18:19,669 --> 00:18:17,360
overrule

451
00:18:22,230 --> 00:18:19,679
the medical is this do you think that

452
00:18:26,390 --> 00:18:22,240
they're offering these sort of things to

453
00:18:28,789 --> 00:18:26,400
help women who are there who would get a

454
00:18:31,350 --> 00:18:28,799
i i think placebo is a too harsh a term

455
00:18:33,830 --> 00:18:31,360
in this situation a soothing

456
00:18:34,630 --> 00:18:33,840
something to to make them feel better

457
00:18:36,549 --> 00:18:34,640
you know not

458
00:18:38,390 --> 00:18:36,559
get better just feel better feel more

459
00:18:41,510 --> 00:18:38,400
relaxed in that situation

460
00:18:44,630 --> 00:18:41,520
um i look

461
00:18:46,789 --> 00:18:44,640
so the chris o'brien life house treats

462
00:18:49,190 --> 00:18:46,799
all kinds of cancers so it's not just

463
00:18:49,990 --> 00:18:49,200
women it's it's men it's older people

464
00:18:52,710 --> 00:18:50,000
it's small

465
00:18:53,909 --> 00:18:52,720
people etc young kids right all the rest

466
00:18:56,310 --> 00:18:53,919
of it so they do

467
00:18:58,150 --> 00:18:56,320
all kinds of cancer there or treat all

468
00:19:00,230 --> 00:18:58,160
kinds of cancer there

469
00:19:01,510 --> 00:19:00,240
i actually think it's perhaps a little

470
00:19:03,990 --> 00:19:01,520
bit more than that to

471
00:19:04,710 --> 00:19:04,000
tell you the truth richard so for

472
00:19:07,110 --> 00:19:04,720
example

473
00:19:09,510 --> 00:19:07,120
i've become quite friendly with the

474
00:19:12,390 --> 00:19:09,520
woman who does the reflexology

475
00:19:14,230 --> 00:19:12,400
only because we it turns out that um

476
00:19:17,350 --> 00:19:14,240
we've got a mutual friend

477
00:19:20,710 --> 00:19:17,360
and also because we're just

478
00:19:23,830 --> 00:19:20,720
chatty women who have get along

479
00:19:28,070 --> 00:19:23,840
um she has told me that

480
00:19:31,190 --> 00:19:28,080
they are aiming to do a peer-reviewed

481
00:19:32,950 --> 00:19:31,200
study into whether reflexology does

482
00:19:33,669 --> 00:19:32,960
bring any benefit so they are actually

483
00:19:36,830 --> 00:19:33,679
trying to

484
00:19:38,630 --> 00:19:36,840
to study these things in ways that are

485
00:19:41,909 --> 00:19:38,640
um

486
00:19:45,029 --> 00:19:41,919
uh you know use the scientific model

487
00:19:49,350 --> 00:19:45,039
and to me that is wonderful

488
00:19:52,870 --> 00:19:49,360
i mean i i am not somebody who

489
00:19:56,789 --> 00:19:52,880
i suspect that reflexology

490
00:19:59,270 --> 00:19:56,799
does very little to treat cancer in any

491
00:20:00,630 --> 00:19:59,280
way but perhaps it can alleviate nausea

492
00:20:04,230 --> 00:20:00,640
for example

493
00:20:07,590 --> 00:20:04,240
perhaps it might be good in terms of

494
00:20:10,789 --> 00:20:07,600
sleeping and things like that um

495
00:20:11,669 --> 00:20:10,799
so i'm quite happy for them to do it and

496
00:20:15,669 --> 00:20:11,679
for them

497
00:20:18,710 --> 00:20:15,679
to also study it um i i

498
00:20:22,230 --> 00:20:18,720
i was offered each of the

499
00:20:25,590 --> 00:20:22,240
complementary medicines um myself

500
00:20:26,710 --> 00:20:25,600
wants to kind of try for free and in my

501
00:20:28,630 --> 00:20:26,720
case i've got an

502
00:20:29,750 --> 00:20:28,640
additional condition which is a hyper

503
00:20:34,230 --> 00:20:29,760
nausea condition

504
00:20:37,430 --> 00:20:34,240
so i've been unbelievably nauseous

505
00:20:39,190 --> 00:20:37,440
basically since diagnosis but

506
00:20:41,110 --> 00:20:39,200
it is now much more under control i've

507
00:20:42,870 --> 00:20:41,120
had all the cancer cut out so i'm only

508
00:20:44,950 --> 00:20:42,880
getting a little bit nauseous

509
00:20:46,549 --> 00:20:44,960
and so when they did the complementary

510
00:20:49,590 --> 00:20:46,559
medicines for me

511
00:20:51,350 --> 00:20:49,600
it was not because they

512
00:20:53,190 --> 00:20:51,360
thought it was going to cure the cancer

513
00:20:55,029 --> 00:20:53,200
or help with the cancer

514
00:20:56,310 --> 00:20:55,039
they were trying to find a way to help

515
00:20:58,390 --> 00:20:56,320
with the nausea

516
00:21:00,070 --> 00:20:58,400
so they thought that perhaps acupuncture

517
00:21:01,990 --> 00:21:00,080
could relieve some of the nausea

518
00:21:04,149 --> 00:21:02,000
perhaps reflexology could release some

519
00:21:06,870 --> 00:21:04,159
of the nausea so that i think

520
00:21:07,830 --> 00:21:06,880
is how they think about what what

521
00:21:10,149 --> 00:21:07,840
they're doing it's

522
00:21:11,029 --> 00:21:10,159
it's whether it can be somewhat helpful

523
00:21:15,350 --> 00:21:11,039
in managing it

524
00:21:18,950 --> 00:21:15,360
but it it doesn't impinge on the real

525
00:21:22,230 --> 00:21:18,960
medicine going on it's certainly no one

526
00:21:24,390 --> 00:21:22,240
at life house in any way shape or form

527
00:21:26,630 --> 00:21:24,400
has suggested that i wouldn't

528
00:21:28,070 --> 00:21:26,640
have all the chemo and the surgery and

529
00:21:32,149 --> 00:21:28,080
all the rest of it

530
00:21:35,510 --> 00:21:32,159
um indeed i think they are very evidence

531
00:21:38,070 --> 00:21:35,520
based and driven one of the really

532
00:21:39,909 --> 00:21:38,080
uh i've had not a huge amount of luck

533
00:21:41,430 --> 00:21:39,919
since this whole thing kicked off but

534
00:21:44,870 --> 00:21:41,440
one of the

535
00:21:47,110 --> 00:21:44,880
strokes of luck i had was that in about

536
00:21:47,909 --> 00:21:47,120
the last 18 months there's been a

537
00:21:51,590 --> 00:21:47,919
sizable

538
00:21:54,310 --> 00:21:51,600
change in how the chemo

539
00:21:56,230 --> 00:21:54,320
and surgery intersect in when in the

540
00:21:58,789 --> 00:21:56,240
case of ovarian cancer

541
00:21:59,350 --> 00:21:58,799
and it used to be that the surgeon would

542
00:22:01,029 --> 00:21:59,360
remove

543
00:22:02,870 --> 00:22:01,039
the cancer and the uterus and the

544
00:22:04,549 --> 00:22:02,880
ovaries and all the rest of it

545
00:22:05,990 --> 00:22:04,559
and then you would have your six rounds

546
00:22:07,350 --> 00:22:06,000
of chemo which is the treatment for

547
00:22:09,110 --> 00:22:07,360
ovarian cancer

548
00:22:10,950 --> 00:22:09,120
and now what they do is they give you

549
00:22:13,190 --> 00:22:10,960
four rounds of chemo

550
00:22:15,590 --> 00:22:13,200
then they perform the surgery and then

551
00:22:19,029 --> 00:22:15,600
they give you two more rounds of chemo

552
00:22:21,430 --> 00:22:19,039
and so the aim is to shrink the cancer

553
00:22:23,270 --> 00:22:21,440
remove the organs and then have use the

554
00:22:24,950 --> 00:22:23,280
last couple of rounds to clean up any

555
00:22:26,710 --> 00:22:24,960
cells that remain

556
00:22:29,830 --> 00:22:26,720
and that's the procedure that i

557
00:22:30,950 --> 00:22:29,840
underwent and i'm so grateful that i did

558
00:22:34,149 --> 00:22:30,960
because

559
00:22:35,350 --> 00:22:34,159
if i had have had that um if i had been

560
00:22:38,390 --> 00:22:35,360
treated

561
00:22:40,950 --> 00:22:38,400
you know even 18 months ago i think it's

562
00:22:42,630 --> 00:22:40,960
very clear that i in all likelihood

563
00:22:43,990 --> 00:22:42,640
would have ended up with a stoma with a

564
00:22:46,230 --> 00:22:44,000
colostomy bag

565
00:22:48,390 --> 00:22:46,240
because they wouldn't have been able to

566
00:22:51,909 --> 00:22:48,400
remove the cancer from the bowel

567
00:22:53,990 --> 00:22:51,919
but because they were because it was

568
00:22:55,430 --> 00:22:54,000
sufficiently shrunk as a result of the

569
00:22:57,909 --> 00:22:55,440
four rounds of chemo

570
00:22:58,470 --> 00:22:57,919
the surgery was much better for me in my

571
00:23:00,549 --> 00:22:58,480
case

572
00:23:02,070 --> 00:23:00,559
so i think they are very evidence driven

573
00:23:05,669 --> 00:23:02,080
they really want to

574
00:23:08,149 --> 00:23:05,679
do the right thing and they um

575
00:23:09,190 --> 00:23:08,159
you know they take evidence and

576
00:23:11,990 --> 00:23:09,200
scientific

577
00:23:12,870 --> 00:23:12,000
process very seriously right now just

578
00:23:16,070 --> 00:23:12,880
quickly one of the

579
00:23:18,390 --> 00:23:16,080
stories you were relating to me uh again

580
00:23:19,830 --> 00:23:18,400
last week over a coffee getting back to

581
00:23:21,430 --> 00:23:19,840
well-meaning possibly while

582
00:23:23,430 --> 00:23:21,440
meeting people somebody was telling you

583
00:23:25,270 --> 00:23:23,440
that you

584
00:23:27,110 --> 00:23:25,280
you had to think the right thoughts to

585
00:23:29,669 --> 00:23:27,120
get better or something like that yes

586
00:23:31,830 --> 00:23:29,679
that was actually a that was actually a

587
00:23:33,750 --> 00:23:31,840
very strange one that was

588
00:23:35,590 --> 00:23:33,760
something that happened to me actually

589
00:23:38,470 --> 00:23:35,600
very recently

590
00:23:40,149 --> 00:23:38,480
um and one of the things about this

591
00:23:43,269 --> 00:23:40,159
whole phenomenon of

592
00:23:43,669 --> 00:23:43,279
of people feeling they can contribute to

593
00:23:47,390 --> 00:23:43,679
my

594
00:23:50,390 --> 00:23:47,400
healing uh without any

595
00:23:53,110 --> 00:23:50,400
seemingly trained without any

596
00:23:54,549 --> 00:23:53,120
apparent training or certification or

597
00:23:57,669 --> 00:23:54,559
qualification

598
00:24:01,350 --> 00:23:57,679
is that i find it very uneasy

599
00:24:02,070 --> 00:24:01,360
about all these brilliant young people

600
00:24:04,470 --> 00:24:02,080
who

601
00:24:05,909 --> 00:24:04,480
do very well at school get themselves

602
00:24:08,710 --> 00:24:05,919
into medical school

603
00:24:10,470 --> 00:24:08,720
study so hard for years and years and

604
00:24:12,310 --> 00:24:10,480
years and it's a grueling degree the

605
00:24:13,029 --> 00:24:12,320
medical degree and then they do their

606
00:24:14,549 --> 00:24:13,039
time

607
00:24:16,789 --> 00:24:14,559
in the hospitals and see all the

608
00:24:18,710 --> 00:24:16,799
different types of you know

609
00:24:20,630 --> 00:24:18,720
practices and all the rest of it and

610
00:24:22,789 --> 00:24:20,640
meanwhile parallel

611
00:24:24,710 --> 00:24:22,799
uh people are you know waking up on a

612
00:24:28,310 --> 00:24:24,720
tuesday and deciding that they can heal

613
00:24:30,549 --> 00:24:28,320
cancer with their you know

614
00:24:31,669 --> 00:24:30,559
whatever whatever's going on so i ran

615
00:24:34,950 --> 00:24:31,679
into a woman

616
00:24:36,630 --> 00:24:34,960
who uh doesn't have cancer

617
00:24:38,789 --> 00:24:36,640
but she was in the company of a number

618
00:24:42,070 --> 00:24:38,799
of people who did

619
00:24:45,190 --> 00:24:42,080
and apparently according to her

620
00:24:46,549 --> 00:24:45,200
uh cancer is a result of any thoughts

621
00:24:49,350 --> 00:24:46,559
that you've had

622
00:24:50,870 --> 00:24:49,360
up until the age of 12 and in order to

623
00:24:54,070 --> 00:24:50,880
deal with your cancer

624
00:24:55,430 --> 00:24:54,080
you need to go back and identify the the

625
00:24:58,789 --> 00:24:55,440
thought pattern

626
00:25:01,669 --> 00:24:58,799
that was responsible and i found this

627
00:25:02,390 --> 00:25:01,679
particular interpretation very hard to

628
00:25:04,230 --> 00:25:02,400
take

629
00:25:06,549 --> 00:25:04,240
and a big part of the reason why i found

630
00:25:10,789 --> 00:25:06,559
it a very off-putting way of

631
00:25:14,789 --> 00:25:10,799
i guess communicating about cancer or

632
00:25:17,830 --> 00:25:14,799
just just not an appealing perspective

633
00:25:21,269 --> 00:25:17,840
was that i thought about all the people

634
00:25:24,789 --> 00:25:21,279
all the young children who have cancer

635
00:25:26,470 --> 00:25:24,799
who might get the feeling that they're

636
00:25:28,390 --> 00:25:26,480
responsible for this

637
00:25:30,470 --> 00:25:28,400
in some way you know it's an awful

638
00:25:30,950 --> 00:25:30,480
feeling it's almost like victim blaming

639
00:25:33,430 --> 00:25:30,960
isn't it

640
00:25:34,070 --> 00:25:33,440
it is almost like victim famine so it's

641
00:25:36,070 --> 00:25:34,080
a really

642
00:25:37,830 --> 00:25:36,080
ultimately it's your fault for something

643
00:25:41,029 --> 00:25:37,840
that happened

644
00:25:44,549 --> 00:25:41,039
way back in decades ago yes and

645
00:25:46,710 --> 00:25:44,559
and not just um you know all the things

646
00:25:49,029 --> 00:25:46,720
that we know you shouldn't do

647
00:25:49,830 --> 00:25:49,039
sitting lying in the sun smoking

648
00:25:51,909 --> 00:25:49,840
cigarettes

649
00:25:53,350 --> 00:25:51,919
not being careful when working with

650
00:25:54,390 --> 00:25:53,360
chemicals all those kinds of things that

651
00:25:56,710 --> 00:25:54,400
we know about

652
00:25:59,190 --> 00:25:56,720
but this is the wrong thought you're

653
00:26:02,549 --> 00:25:59,200
having a thought that gives you cancer

654
00:26:04,710 --> 00:26:02,559
it certainly gives you a lot of power

655
00:26:06,310 --> 00:26:04,720
but i you know i didn't give myself

656
00:26:08,149 --> 00:26:06,320
ovarian cancer it's no

657
00:26:09,990 --> 00:26:08,159
it's just not not true and it's not

658
00:26:12,950 --> 00:26:10,000
helpful and

659
00:26:14,070 --> 00:26:12,960
i think i'm in a position to be able to

660
00:26:17,590 --> 00:26:14,080
um

661
00:26:18,710 --> 00:26:17,600
you know see that kind of contribution

662
00:26:22,149 --> 00:26:18,720
for what it is

663
00:26:24,549 --> 00:26:22,159
but i do worry about people who are

664
00:26:26,470 --> 00:26:24,559
perhaps going to be influenced or give

665
00:26:29,350 --> 00:26:26,480
some credence to this kind of thing

666
00:26:31,110 --> 00:26:29,360
yeah it's very common unfortunately as i

667
00:26:32,710 --> 00:26:31,120
said with people in your situation and

668
00:26:34,549 --> 00:26:32,720
other diseases

669
00:26:36,230 --> 00:26:34,559
lots of well-meaning people i know it

670
00:26:37,990 --> 00:26:36,240
works because it worked for me or i saw

671
00:26:40,710 --> 00:26:38,000
this on the internet or this guy told

672
00:26:41,590 --> 00:26:40,720
me or what goes on and we've certainly

673
00:26:43,590 --> 00:26:41,600
dealt with that in the

674
00:26:44,710 --> 00:26:43,600
the skeptics so siobhan from your

675
00:26:46,870 --> 00:26:44,720
experience and your

676
00:26:48,310 --> 00:26:46,880
your point of view what's maybe the best

677
00:26:49,750 --> 00:26:48,320
advice you have to offer for our

678
00:26:53,029 --> 00:26:49,760
listeners

679
00:26:56,390 --> 00:26:53,039
so what i encourage women to do

680
00:26:59,830 --> 00:26:56,400
is to be mindful

681
00:27:02,070 --> 00:26:59,840
about any changes in their body the

682
00:27:03,350 --> 00:27:02,080
best indicator that we have at the

683
00:27:06,870 --> 00:27:03,360
moment that

684
00:27:10,070 --> 00:27:06,880
ovarian cancer might be at play is this

685
00:27:13,590 --> 00:27:10,080
bloating that i was talking about but

686
00:27:16,390 --> 00:27:13,600
i really really encourage anyone who's

687
00:27:19,590 --> 00:27:16,400
concerned about changes in their body

688
00:27:23,350 --> 00:27:19,600
to go to the doctors but

689
00:27:25,430 --> 00:27:23,360
be persistent and insistent

690
00:27:27,350 --> 00:27:25,440
because one of the things that happened

691
00:27:30,549 --> 00:27:27,360
to me that i noticed was

692
00:27:34,549 --> 00:27:30,559
that the doctors

693
00:27:38,070 --> 00:27:34,559
didn't necessarily take it seriously and

694
00:27:41,190 --> 00:27:38,080
didn't necessarily know what to look for

695
00:27:43,990 --> 00:27:41,200
so as i said my first diagnosis was

696
00:27:44,630 --> 00:27:44,000
constipation and i wasn't tested for the

697
00:27:49,430 --> 00:27:44,640
more

698
00:27:52,870 --> 00:27:49,440
i think i probably should have been

699
00:27:56,870 --> 00:27:52,880
so i would really encourage people to

700
00:27:59,430 --> 00:27:56,880
take a strong stand to say to the doctor

701
00:28:00,950 --> 00:27:59,440
have you considered ovarian cancer

702
00:28:04,070 --> 00:28:00,960
because i think

703
00:28:06,149 --> 00:28:04,080
we also need to remember that because it

704
00:28:08,789 --> 00:28:06,159
is a rare cancer

705
00:28:11,350 --> 00:28:08,799
many many gps will perhaps never even

706
00:28:15,350 --> 00:28:11,360
come across it during their practice

707
00:28:19,269 --> 00:28:15,360
so i think it is for women to be

708
00:28:21,110 --> 00:28:19,279
assertive and to ask to be tested

709
00:28:23,269 --> 00:28:21,120
uh the thought that there are women who

710
00:28:24,789 --> 00:28:23,279
get to who don't know they have ovarian

711
00:28:28,070 --> 00:28:24,799
cancer until they're stage

712
00:28:28,870 --> 00:28:28,080
four that's terrible that means that

713
00:28:31,669 --> 00:28:28,880
they have

714
00:28:33,669 --> 00:28:31,679
endured you know some level of

715
00:28:36,789 --> 00:28:33,679
discomfort and bloating and

716
00:28:37,350 --> 00:28:36,799
whatever else to get to stage four so i

717
00:28:40,470 --> 00:28:37,360
think

718
00:28:44,230 --> 00:28:40,480
be proactive be assertive and

719
00:28:45,590 --> 00:28:44,240
also remind your gp about these rare

720
00:28:48,389 --> 00:28:45,600
cancers

721
00:28:49,430 --> 00:28:48,399
and maybe listeners you might um know

722
00:28:51,750 --> 00:28:49,440
somebody whose

723
00:28:53,909 --> 00:28:51,760
first choice or first port of call might

724
00:28:55,430 --> 00:28:53,919
just be to see a naturopath or a natural

725
00:28:57,350 --> 00:28:55,440
heal or something like that

726
00:28:59,350 --> 00:28:57,360
but i guess a strong message would be

727
00:29:00,710 --> 00:28:59,360
okay if you know it's their free choice

728
00:29:01,430 --> 00:29:00,720
if they want to do that but for heaven's

729
00:29:04,310 --> 00:29:01,440
sake

730
00:29:05,669 --> 00:29:04,320
also see a gp or and even get a second

731
00:29:08,710 --> 00:29:05,679
opinion

732
00:29:12,950 --> 00:29:08,720
absolutely i

733
00:29:18,870 --> 00:29:16,070
dealing with ovarian cancer successfully

734
00:29:19,669 --> 00:29:18,880
really has to involve a medical

735
00:29:23,029 --> 00:29:19,679
professional

736
00:29:25,990 --> 00:29:23,039
a doctor uh it the cancer

737
00:29:27,510 --> 00:29:26,000
will spread and it will spread quickly

738
00:29:31,029 --> 00:29:27,520
and it will kill you

739
00:29:33,110 --> 00:29:31,039
if you don't try traditional

740
00:29:35,510 --> 00:29:33,120
if you don't fall back on or if you

741
00:29:38,549 --> 00:29:35,520
don't utilize most fully

742
00:29:40,389 --> 00:29:38,559
the kind of the western medical model

743
00:29:41,990 --> 00:29:40,399
yeah in the end with something as

744
00:29:43,590 --> 00:29:42,000
serious as that it's homeopathy is

745
00:29:44,870 --> 00:29:43,600
really not going to

746
00:29:47,029 --> 00:29:44,880
help much at all it's really the

747
00:29:50,630 --> 00:29:47,039
scientific basis not at all

748
00:29:53,669 --> 00:29:50,640
and i do also think if you are

749
00:29:55,590 --> 00:29:53,679
determined or you have a strong desire

750
00:29:58,950 --> 00:29:55,600
to use homeopathy

751
00:30:02,310 --> 00:29:58,960
then it really needs to be

752
00:30:04,149 --> 00:30:02,320
the thing that is complementary to

753
00:30:06,389 --> 00:30:04,159
the other medical treatments that you're

754
00:30:08,710 --> 00:30:06,399
getting um

755
00:30:10,070 --> 00:30:08,720
life house even lifehouse with their

756
00:30:11,830 --> 00:30:10,080
very progressive attitude to

757
00:30:14,789 --> 00:30:11,840
complementary medicines

758
00:30:15,510 --> 00:30:14,799
don't offer homeopathy that's good to

759
00:30:17,590 --> 00:30:15,520
hear

760
00:30:18,549 --> 00:30:17,600
well doctor siobhano sullivan thank you

761
00:30:20,789 --> 00:30:18,559
very much it's been

762
00:30:22,149 --> 00:30:20,799
great to see you once again yeah thank

763
00:30:22,710 --> 00:30:22,159
you it's been a while since we've really

764
00:30:25,029 --> 00:30:22,720
caught up

765
00:30:26,149 --> 00:30:25,039
it's been a while and i really think

766
00:30:28,070 --> 00:30:26,159
it's wonderful

767
00:30:29,430 --> 00:30:28,080
all the work you're doing to educate

768
00:30:31,590 --> 00:30:29,440
people and to

769
00:30:33,590 --> 00:30:31,600
to engage them in these really important

770
00:30:34,710 --> 00:30:33,600
conversations so thank you so much for

771
00:30:36,789 --> 00:30:34,720
everything you do

772
00:30:38,950 --> 00:30:36,799
for the world of evidence thank you very

773
00:30:40,549 --> 00:30:38,960
much and we're just saying before here i

774
00:30:41,510 --> 00:30:40,559
am sitting on the floor you're up there

775
00:30:42,789 --> 00:30:41,520
on the couch and we've got our

776
00:30:45,510 --> 00:30:42,799
microphone set up

777
00:30:47,350 --> 00:30:45,520
and this is almost exactly where we were

778
00:30:47,990 --> 00:30:47,360
six years ago when i was interviewing

779
00:30:51,029 --> 00:30:48,000
you about

780
00:30:53,430 --> 00:30:51,039
uh animal welfare yes yes yeah

781
00:30:55,430 --> 00:30:53,440
so it's wonderful to be back and and

782
00:30:56,630 --> 00:30:55,440
your podcast you started it is still

783
00:30:58,310 --> 00:30:56,640
going isn't it yes

784
00:31:00,630 --> 00:30:58,320
so i've got a podcast called knowing

785
00:31:03,990 --> 00:31:00,640
animals uh we talk about

786
00:31:05,750 --> 00:31:04,000
animal issues usually uh something to do

787
00:31:06,789 --> 00:31:05,760
we talk about basically a published

788
00:31:08,230 --> 00:31:06,799
piece of work

789
00:31:11,110 --> 00:31:08,240
where animals at the center of the

790
00:31:13,509 --> 00:31:11,120
discussion at the moment i'm not hosting

791
00:31:15,990 --> 00:31:13,519
it because of my illness but a wonderful

792
00:31:18,630 --> 00:31:16,000
colleague of mine has taken it over

793
00:31:20,549 --> 00:31:18,640
and uh it is still in my view a very

794
00:31:23,190 --> 00:31:20,559
interesting and informative podcast

795
00:31:24,549 --> 00:31:23,200
folks i will link to that podcast in

796
00:31:25,269 --> 00:31:24,559
this week's show notes if you're

797
00:31:27,350 --> 00:31:25,279
interested in

798
00:31:28,789 --> 00:31:27,360
animal welfare which we all should be

799
00:31:31,269 --> 00:31:28,799
that's the podcast for you well

800
00:31:32,070 --> 00:31:31,279
again siobhan wonderful to see you again

801
00:31:46,389 --> 00:31:32,080
and thank you

802
00:31:49,029 --> 00:31:46,399
thanks so much richard

803
00:31:50,950 --> 00:31:49,039
hi my name's joe thornley and i'd like

804
00:31:52,870 --> 00:31:50,960
you to join my co

805
00:31:54,310 --> 00:31:52,880
i'd like you to listen to my podcast

806
00:31:56,710 --> 00:31:54,320
about cults

807
00:31:58,710 --> 00:31:56,720
called zealot it's available pretty much

808
00:32:00,149 --> 00:31:58,720
anywhere you find podcasts with further

809
00:32:03,430 --> 00:32:00,159
reading on the zealot facebook

810
00:32:05,190 --> 00:32:03,440
page each episode a guest joins me to

811
00:32:07,350 --> 00:32:05,200
talk about a specific cult where we

812
00:32:12,310 --> 00:32:07,360
answer the big questions like

813
00:32:21,190 --> 00:32:14,650
and does anyone think they're jesus

814
00:32:25,029 --> 00:32:22,789
pop over to my compound and have a

815
00:32:28,470 --> 00:32:25,039
listen i've just mixed up a fresh batch

816
00:32:34,630 --> 00:32:28,480
of kool-aid

817
00:32:42,549 --> 00:32:38,710
here's maynard's spooky action

818
00:32:44,470 --> 00:32:42,559
at a distance

819
00:32:45,750 --> 00:32:44,480
and we're back with dr ramon kai talking

820
00:32:47,990 --> 00:32:45,760
about his book

821
00:32:50,070 --> 00:32:48,000
fake medicine and it's even got its own

822
00:32:52,870 --> 00:32:50,080
tinfoil hat on the front cover

823
00:32:54,470 --> 00:32:52,880
yeah so i've got a special tinfoil cover

824
00:32:55,190 --> 00:32:54,480
to uh to go over the book just for you

825
00:32:57,110 --> 00:32:55,200
maynard

826
00:32:58,710 --> 00:32:57,120
and what about the actual products that

827
00:33:00,549 --> 00:32:58,720
are being sold that you mentioned in the

828
00:33:04,230 --> 00:33:00,559
fake medicine book what is your favorite

829
00:33:04,549 --> 00:33:04,240
oh come on oh where do i start i i think

830
00:33:08,950 --> 00:33:04,559
my

831
00:33:09,990 --> 00:33:08,960
from uh from pete evans um i think if

832
00:33:13,029 --> 00:33:10,000
you're selling

833
00:33:15,590 --> 00:33:13,039
a uh a fluorescent light for

834
00:33:16,470 --> 00:33:15,600
more than 25 000 australian dollars so

835
00:33:18,789 --> 00:33:16,480
15 000

836
00:33:20,310 --> 00:33:18,799
us dollars and telling people that it's

837
00:33:22,789 --> 00:33:20,320
going to be protecting you from the

838
00:33:24,870 --> 00:33:22,799
from the wuhan coronavirus or else that

839
00:33:26,470 --> 00:33:24,880
it could cure your rheumatoid arthritis

840
00:33:29,669 --> 00:33:26,480
or autoimmune diseases

841
00:33:32,710 --> 00:33:29,679
um like just the imagery of people like

842
00:33:35,590 --> 00:33:32,720
families sitting around a giant

843
00:33:36,549 --> 00:33:35,600
like lamp that looks like it's um from

844
00:33:39,029 --> 00:33:36,559
back to the future

845
00:33:39,830 --> 00:33:39,039
from best to sit around the light with a

846
00:33:41,430 --> 00:33:39,840
player piano

847
00:33:42,789 --> 00:33:41,440
with the piano rolling and having a bit

848
00:33:44,310 --> 00:33:42,799
of a sing-along yeah sure that would

849
00:33:45,269 --> 00:33:44,320
affect the resonance that's coming out

850
00:33:46,950 --> 00:33:45,279
of the land sorry

851
00:33:48,710 --> 00:33:46,960
yes now isn't there something medical

852
00:33:49,669 --> 00:33:48,720
that actually does do that on a small

853
00:33:52,310 --> 00:33:49,679
scale

854
00:33:53,669 --> 00:33:52,320
uh well we do use a narrow band

855
00:33:56,310 --> 00:33:53,679
ultraviolet light

856
00:33:57,190 --> 00:33:56,320
um to help people with psoriasis or skin

857
00:34:00,149 --> 00:33:57,200
conditions

858
00:34:02,070 --> 00:34:00,159
um so we we use that all the time people

859
00:34:03,990 --> 00:34:02,080
will go in like even five times a week

860
00:34:05,990 --> 00:34:04,000
and have like even a few seconds

861
00:34:07,350 --> 00:34:06,000
under a uv light let's put a 500 watt

862
00:34:08,069 --> 00:34:07,360
bulb with that in our ceiling and away

863
00:34:09,669 --> 00:34:08,079
we go well

864
00:34:11,109 --> 00:34:09,679
i've talked to some patients who have

865
00:34:13,829 --> 00:34:11,119
said oh yes i've heard that

866
00:34:16,230 --> 00:34:13,839
um uv light is good for treating my

867
00:34:19,349 --> 00:34:16,240
psoriasis so i've i've gone and

868
00:34:20,950 --> 00:34:19,359
yeah gone into a solarium

869
00:34:22,710 --> 00:34:20,960
but the whole problem is if you're going

870
00:34:24,470 --> 00:34:22,720
into solarium and you're lying there for

871
00:34:26,149 --> 00:34:24,480
a few minutes under a broadband

872
00:34:28,629 --> 00:34:26,159
ultraviolet light then you're much more

873
00:34:30,710 --> 00:34:28,639
likely to get cancer from it

874
00:34:32,950 --> 00:34:30,720
and solariums have sort of been banned

875
00:34:33,990 --> 00:34:32,960
across australia and many countries

876
00:34:36,550 --> 00:34:34,000
because they do

877
00:34:37,669 --> 00:34:36,560
cause cancer they cause melanomas

878
00:34:40,310 --> 00:34:37,679
particularly to

879
00:34:41,510 --> 00:34:40,320
to evolve in your skin um but yeah like

880
00:34:43,829 --> 00:34:41,520
this this is where this

881
00:34:45,990 --> 00:34:43,839
this translation of of what we use in

882
00:34:47,909 --> 00:34:46,000
medicine so narrow band spectrum

883
00:34:50,550 --> 00:34:47,919
versus broadband spectrum is totally

884
00:34:52,310 --> 00:34:50,560
lost and people do their own treatment

885
00:34:53,909 --> 00:34:52,320
and can actually cause themselves

886
00:34:55,750 --> 00:34:53,919
problems oh well

887
00:34:58,230 --> 00:34:55,760
time for the boring bit now what is the

888
00:34:59,910 --> 00:34:58,240
best advice as a gp you give people to

889
00:35:01,109 --> 00:34:59,920
living a good life and having the right

890
00:35:02,150 --> 00:35:01,119
weight and doing thing what is the

891
00:35:04,630 --> 00:35:02,160
simple formula

892
00:35:06,310 --> 00:35:04,640
that we all should follow i think one of

893
00:35:09,589 --> 00:35:06,320
one of the formulas to follow

894
00:35:11,829 --> 00:35:09,599
is uh see see your gp

895
00:35:12,790 --> 00:35:11,839
um but one of one of the things that i

896
00:35:14,630 --> 00:35:12,800
sort of like

897
00:35:16,310 --> 00:35:14,640
came to the conclusion of is that if

898
00:35:17,829 --> 00:35:16,320
people don't get the right answer from

899
00:35:20,870 --> 00:35:17,839
their gp or their doctor

900
00:35:22,870 --> 00:35:20,880
then they will search elsewhere and so a

901
00:35:25,030 --> 00:35:22,880
lot of people do go searching for

902
00:35:26,310 --> 00:35:25,040
for a naturopath or a chiropractor or an

903
00:35:29,270 --> 00:35:26,320
osteopath to treat

904
00:35:31,190 --> 00:35:29,280
different problems and like even i've

905
00:35:33,190 --> 00:35:31,200
had patients who have gone and sort of

906
00:35:34,069 --> 00:35:33,200
applied kinesiologists and so a lot of

907
00:35:36,470 --> 00:35:34,079
these people

908
00:35:37,829 --> 00:35:36,480
um like don't have any idea what they're

909
00:35:38,710 --> 00:35:37,839
doing they're not going to be solving

910
00:35:41,349 --> 00:35:38,720
your problems

911
00:35:42,950 --> 00:35:41,359
they may be very confident about it um

912
00:35:44,630 --> 00:35:42,960
but one of the principles that i'd like

913
00:35:45,829 --> 00:35:44,640
to sort of like get out there as if

914
00:35:49,589 --> 00:35:45,839
if you're not getting the right answer

915
00:35:52,310 --> 00:35:49,599
from your doctor then see another doctor

916
00:35:54,150 --> 00:35:52,320
like like there are many of us there are

917
00:35:55,750 --> 00:35:54,160
thousands of us around australia

918
00:35:57,990 --> 00:35:55,760
if you're not getting the right answers

919
00:36:00,150 --> 00:35:58,000
then there is somebody else who

920
00:36:02,150 --> 00:36:00,160
can help and you're much more likely to

921
00:36:03,349 --> 00:36:02,160
to have your problem sorted if you're

922
00:36:05,430 --> 00:36:03,359
seeing another doctor

923
00:36:07,349 --> 00:36:05,440
and getting another medical opinion than

924
00:36:08,150 --> 00:36:07,359
uh than having a naturopathic opinion

925
00:36:09,430 --> 00:36:08,160
for example

926
00:36:10,870 --> 00:36:09,440
okay because i think this is a little

927
00:36:11,990 --> 00:36:10,880
bit like the social media bubble because

928
00:36:13,270 --> 00:36:12,000
everyone's used to getting their answer

929
00:36:14,710 --> 00:36:13,280
particularly with psychiatrists

930
00:36:15,750 --> 00:36:14,720
you go to the psychiatrist and you think

931
00:36:17,190 --> 00:36:15,760
you know what's wrong with you when you

932
00:36:17,829 --> 00:36:17,200
start and he goes oh no actually it's

933
00:36:21,349 --> 00:36:17,839
this

934
00:36:22,069 --> 00:36:21,359
then that can happen so well i think

935
00:36:24,630 --> 00:36:22,079
some people

936
00:36:25,990 --> 00:36:24,640
will they will get an answer that

937
00:36:28,630 --> 00:36:26,000
they're not wanting as

938
00:36:30,150 --> 00:36:28,640
well so if you've got cancer and you're

939
00:36:32,390 --> 00:36:30,160
you think that you've treated it

940
00:36:33,430 --> 00:36:32,400
um by doing your own sort of like green

941
00:36:35,750 --> 00:36:33,440
smoothies or

942
00:36:37,270 --> 00:36:35,760
coffee enemas for example um and then

943
00:36:37,589 --> 00:36:37,280
you're seeing an oncologist who tells

944
00:36:43,510 --> 00:36:37,599
you

945
00:36:44,310 --> 00:36:43,520
another oncologist and ask them for

946
00:36:46,230 --> 00:36:44,320
their opinion

947
00:36:48,069 --> 00:36:46,240
than if you go and see somebody else

948
00:36:49,750 --> 00:36:48,079
who's into alternative or complementary

949
00:36:51,109 --> 00:36:49,760
medicine because they may tell you oh

950
00:36:52,069 --> 00:36:51,119
yes you've done the right thing and your

951
00:36:54,390 --> 00:36:52,079
cancer's gone

952
00:36:56,069 --> 00:36:54,400
without doing any tests or at having any

953
00:36:58,470 --> 00:36:56,079
basis for that opinion

954
00:37:00,230 --> 00:36:58,480
so if if it's still brewing in you then

955
00:37:03,190 --> 00:37:00,240
um then you're needing to address it

956
00:37:03,990 --> 00:37:03,200
so i think it's it's seeking um

957
00:37:06,710 --> 00:37:04,000
professional

958
00:37:07,990 --> 00:37:06,720
and expertise opinions rather than

959
00:37:10,870 --> 00:37:08,000
heading into different areas

960
00:37:12,310 --> 00:37:10,880
of of cooking of all my relationships i

961
00:37:14,390 --> 00:37:12,320
always get a second opinion that's for

962
00:37:14,950 --> 00:37:14,400
sure but that's not medicine but what is

963
00:37:18,230 --> 00:37:14,960
medicine

964
00:37:19,990 --> 00:37:18,240
brahmacai hashette

965
00:37:21,670 --> 00:37:20,000
and where could they get that online um

966
00:37:22,950 --> 00:37:21,680
so it should be an all good and bad

967
00:37:25,510 --> 00:37:22,960
bookstores i'm sure

968
00:37:26,390 --> 00:37:25,520
very soon um and it will be available on

969
00:37:28,230 --> 00:37:26,400
booktopia

970
00:37:30,230 --> 00:37:28,240
and amazon too if you want to order it

971
00:37:31,109 --> 00:37:30,240
online cool and you're going to do the

972
00:37:32,870 --> 00:37:31,119
tour the big

973
00:37:34,230 --> 00:37:32,880
you know rock arena style tour around

974
00:37:36,550 --> 00:37:34,240
australia oh look

975
00:37:37,990 --> 00:37:36,560
i think covert is uh destroying a bit of

976
00:37:40,150 --> 00:37:38,000
the traveling tours

977
00:37:41,750 --> 00:37:40,160
at the moment uh so i think i'll be

978
00:37:43,990 --> 00:37:41,760
traveling around my living room

979
00:37:46,870 --> 00:37:44,000
uh we might have a book launch uh in the

980
00:37:47,990 --> 00:37:46,880
flesh um somewhere based in sydney uh to

981
00:37:51,030 --> 00:37:48,000
be confirmed

982
00:37:51,829 --> 00:37:51,040
um at covert pending of course uh covert

983
00:37:53,750 --> 00:37:51,839
allowing

984
00:37:55,030 --> 00:37:53,760
um but yeah no no major sort of like

985
00:37:57,030 --> 00:37:55,040
playing trips around the planet at this

986
00:37:58,470 --> 00:37:57,040
point of time okay look and just a final

987
00:37:59,510 --> 00:37:58,480
note there i know you know a lot of

988
00:38:00,790 --> 00:37:59,520
doctors there you've got a bit of

989
00:38:02,710 --> 00:38:00,800
influence do you think you could

990
00:38:04,069 --> 00:38:02,720
could you get get me by name into the

991
00:38:06,790 --> 00:38:04,079
dsm-6 when it comes

992
00:38:08,069 --> 00:38:06,800
out uh i think we we are planning for

993
00:38:10,790 --> 00:38:08,079
the maynard disorder

994
00:38:11,910 --> 00:38:10,800
to uh to be in the dsm-6 that is

995
00:38:13,750 --> 00:38:11,920
definitely

996
00:38:14,950 --> 00:38:13,760
in place put that in your pipe and vape

997
00:38:31,990 --> 00:38:14,960
it kids

998
00:38:35,750 --> 00:38:34,150
hello this is maynard did you know that

999
00:38:36,390 --> 00:38:35,760
you could listen to the skeptic zone on

1000
00:38:43,829 --> 00:38:36,400
youtube

1001
00:38:47,750 --> 00:38:46,390
also you can hear 40 logical fallacies

1002
00:38:49,589 --> 00:38:47,760
with michelle bigesma

1003
00:38:53,430 --> 00:38:49,599
and funny sketches with richard saunders

1004
00:39:04,920 --> 00:38:55,109
just click on the youtube links on the

1005
00:39:04,930 --> 00:39:12,829
[Music]

1006
00:39:12,839 --> 00:39:16,210
so

1007
00:39:19,670 --> 00:39:17,750
[Music]

1008
00:39:22,150 --> 00:39:19,680
now it's time once again to dive into

1009
00:39:23,829 --> 00:39:22,160
the treasure trove of trove the online

1010
00:39:26,550 --> 00:39:23,839
resource from the australian government

1011
00:39:28,310 --> 00:39:26,560
and the national library of australia

1012
00:39:31,190 --> 00:39:28,320
thousands dare i say millions of

1013
00:39:34,310 --> 00:39:31,200
digitized pages from newspapers gazettes

1014
00:39:37,510 --> 00:39:34,320
journals periodicals magazines and so on

1015
00:39:41,030 --> 00:39:37,520
fully searchable what a wonderful

1016
00:39:44,870 --> 00:39:43,190
dot a trove.nla.gov.edu and for us

1017
00:39:45,990 --> 00:39:44,880
certainly here at the skeptic zone a

1018
00:39:48,790 --> 00:39:46,000
treasure trove

1019
00:39:49,829 --> 00:39:48,800
indeed it's educational and quite

1020
00:39:53,190 --> 00:39:49,839
fascinating to

1021
00:39:54,790 --> 00:39:53,200
read reports and items going back

1022
00:39:56,550 --> 00:39:54,800
over the last couple of hundred years

1023
00:39:58,470 --> 00:39:56,560
here in australia

1024
00:40:00,470 --> 00:39:58,480
and this week i thought we would look

1025
00:40:03,220 --> 00:40:00,480
for references reports to

1026
00:40:07,510 --> 00:40:03,230
the great harry houdini

1027
00:40:09,510 --> 00:40:07,520
[Music]

1028
00:40:11,190 --> 00:40:09,520
now why harry houdini well apart from

1029
00:40:14,069 --> 00:40:11,200
being one of them

1030
00:40:15,030 --> 00:40:14,079
recent history's biggest characters he

1031
00:40:16,790 --> 00:40:15,040
certainly

1032
00:40:19,589 --> 00:40:16,800
made an impression in the skeptical

1033
00:40:22,630 --> 00:40:19,599
world with his debunking of psychics and

1034
00:40:25,270 --> 00:40:22,640
so on and seances uh

1035
00:40:27,109 --> 00:40:25,280
in the latter part of his career he was

1036
00:40:28,630 --> 00:40:27,119
very desperate to contact his uh

1037
00:40:32,230 --> 00:40:28,640
deceased mother

1038
00:40:34,150 --> 00:40:32,240
and soon discovered that the seance he

1039
00:40:36,390 --> 00:40:34,160
attended well the psychics were pulling

1040
00:40:39,109 --> 00:40:36,400
all sorts of shenanigans and

1041
00:40:39,990 --> 00:40:39,119
trickery and believe it or not that

1042
00:40:41,810 --> 00:40:40,000
still

1043
00:40:45,030 --> 00:40:41,820
goes on today

1044
00:40:47,349 --> 00:40:45,040
[Music]

1045
00:40:48,390 --> 00:40:47,359
houdini is also credited as the first

1046
00:40:50,309 --> 00:40:48,400
man to fly

1047
00:40:52,309 --> 00:40:50,319
an airplane in australia although that

1048
00:40:54,870 --> 00:40:52,319
is disputed

1049
00:40:55,510 --> 00:40:54,880
he was at the very least one of the

1050
00:40:59,430 --> 00:40:55,520
first

1051
00:41:03,430 --> 00:40:59,440
men to fly an airplane in australia

1052
00:41:05,510 --> 00:41:03,440
and we now turn to trove and we have

1053
00:41:07,190 --> 00:41:05,520
many results come back when we search

1054
00:41:09,829 --> 00:41:07,200
for harry houdini as you

1055
00:41:11,790 --> 00:41:09,839
may well imagine but let's pick one up

1056
00:41:15,270 --> 00:41:11,800
here from the year

1057
00:41:18,069 --> 00:41:15,280
1910 and this is published in the

1058
00:41:19,030 --> 00:41:18,079
daily news from perth western australia

1059
00:41:23,030 --> 00:41:19,040
thursday

1060
00:41:27,910 --> 00:41:23,040
the 17th of february 1910

1061
00:41:30,069 --> 00:41:27,920
the hand cuff king performs in the yarra

1062
00:41:32,150 --> 00:41:30,079
now the yara is the name of the river

1063
00:41:35,349 --> 00:41:32,160
running through melbourne

1064
00:41:39,109 --> 00:41:35,359
melbourne this afternoon houdini the

1065
00:41:41,589 --> 00:41:39,119
handcuff king in the presence of about 4

1066
00:41:42,710 --> 00:41:41,599
000 people with his hands handcuffed

1067
00:41:45,990 --> 00:41:42,720
behind him

1068
00:41:48,550 --> 00:41:46,000
and with a chain on his legs

1069
00:41:50,150 --> 00:41:48,560
dived into the error this afternoon from

1070
00:41:53,829 --> 00:41:50,160
the queen's bridge

1071
00:41:57,030 --> 00:41:53,839
in about a minute he reappeared free

1072
00:41:59,270 --> 00:41:57,040
from the shackles of course houdini was

1073
00:42:01,829 --> 00:41:59,280
famous for many things

1074
00:42:03,109 --> 00:42:01,839
and not least traveling around the world

1075
00:42:04,870 --> 00:42:03,119
giving performances

1076
00:42:07,349 --> 00:42:04,880
and the next item comes to us from the

1077
00:42:10,870 --> 00:42:07,359
advertiser adelaide south australia

1078
00:42:13,750 --> 00:42:10,880
dated the 12th of march 1910 houdini

1079
00:42:16,230 --> 00:42:13,760
takes a milk bath houdini at the

1080
00:42:19,430 --> 00:42:16,240
melbourne opera house on wednesday night

1081
00:42:22,550 --> 00:42:19,440
says the age again interested

1082
00:42:24,790 --> 00:42:22,560
a crowded audience by performing another

1083
00:42:27,109 --> 00:42:24,800
of his mystifying acts

1084
00:42:28,309 --> 00:42:27,119
this time he fooled a syndicate of

1085
00:42:31,190 --> 00:42:28,319
milkman

1086
00:42:32,630 --> 00:42:31,200
which endeavored to drown him in a huge

1087
00:42:35,030 --> 00:42:32,640
can of milk

1088
00:42:35,829 --> 00:42:35,040
houdini had nightly escaped from the

1089
00:42:38,470 --> 00:42:35,839
same can

1090
00:42:40,950 --> 00:42:38,480
filled with water and the milkman came

1091
00:42:43,270 --> 00:42:40,960
to the conclusion that he had succeeded

1092
00:42:45,510 --> 00:42:43,280
because he could see through the water

1093
00:42:46,470 --> 00:42:45,520
the milk vendors had thought the whole

1094
00:42:48,950 --> 00:42:46,480
business out

1095
00:42:49,829 --> 00:42:48,960
there isn't any water in ours they

1096
00:42:52,950 --> 00:42:49,839
reasoned

1097
00:42:56,069 --> 00:42:52,960
therefore houdini won't be able to see

1098
00:42:58,150 --> 00:42:56,079
where the catches are that release him

1099
00:42:59,829 --> 00:42:58,160
he'll either have to drink the whole can

1100
00:43:02,309 --> 00:42:59,839
full or be drowned

1101
00:43:03,430 --> 00:43:02,319
houdini delivered his customary lecture

1102
00:43:05,670 --> 00:43:03,440
tied in

1103
00:43:07,589 --> 00:43:05,680
dress clothes and impressed upon his

1104
00:43:11,190 --> 00:43:07,599
audience the risk he ran

1105
00:43:12,790 --> 00:43:11,200
in order that the desire of the yodlers

1106
00:43:14,790 --> 00:43:12,800
that he should meet his ending

1107
00:43:17,589 --> 00:43:14,800
gloriously in a can of milk

1108
00:43:18,069 --> 00:43:17,599
should be frustrated he stationed a man

1109
00:43:21,030 --> 00:43:18,079
with an

1110
00:43:21,589 --> 00:43:21,040
axe and a stop clock in a position where

1111
00:43:25,270 --> 00:43:21,599
he

1112
00:43:28,710 --> 00:43:25,280
it

1113
00:43:31,829 --> 00:43:28,720
should he not appear in a certain time

1114
00:43:34,230 --> 00:43:31,839
then to show that he really did go in

1115
00:43:36,550 --> 00:43:34,240
under the milk he submerged himself in

1116
00:43:39,589 --> 00:43:36,560
the best pasteurized willemier

1117
00:43:43,670 --> 00:43:39,599
for a minute and a half without the lid

1118
00:43:47,030 --> 00:43:43,680
on and emerged happy

1119
00:43:48,790 --> 00:43:47,040
then he went under for the test the can

1120
00:43:51,190 --> 00:43:48,800
was filled to the brim

1121
00:43:52,470 --> 00:43:51,200
houdini as far as could be seen sank

1122
00:43:54,710 --> 00:43:52,480
under the fluid

1123
00:43:56,470 --> 00:43:54,720
the lid was clapped on and locked and

1124
00:43:58,630 --> 00:43:56,480
the canopy drawn over

1125
00:43:59,990 --> 00:43:58,640
in less than three minutes houdini was

1126
00:44:02,069 --> 00:44:00,000
free and the can

1127
00:44:03,430 --> 00:44:02,079
locked and filled with milk was still

1128
00:44:06,630 --> 00:44:03,440
there the milk

1129
00:44:07,670 --> 00:44:06,640
carters stood amazed and the whole house

1130
00:44:11,030 --> 00:44:07,680
applauded

1131
00:44:13,349 --> 00:44:11,040
just to show that he liked milk houdini

1132
00:44:16,790 --> 00:44:13,359
took another bath in the same can

1133
00:44:19,829 --> 00:44:16,800
which like the widow's curse of oil

1134
00:44:21,990 --> 00:44:19,839
seemed to be always full houdini frankly

1135
00:44:25,349 --> 00:44:22,000
admitted that it was all a trick

1136
00:44:27,829 --> 00:44:25,359
but you don't know how it's done

1137
00:44:29,510 --> 00:44:27,839
now we've seen many times on tv and

1138
00:44:31,829 --> 00:44:29,520
movies and so forth

1139
00:44:32,630 --> 00:44:31,839
recreations of houdini's life and the

1140
00:44:35,109 --> 00:44:32,640
milk can

1141
00:44:37,190 --> 00:44:35,119
escape but wouldn't it have been

1142
00:44:39,270 --> 00:44:37,200
marvellous to see it in person

1143
00:44:41,829 --> 00:44:39,280
now the next item we have comes to us

1144
00:44:46,230 --> 00:44:41,839
from the sydney morning herald dated the

1145
00:44:48,870 --> 00:44:46,240
17th of march 2010 learning to fly

1146
00:44:49,750 --> 00:44:48,880
experiments in victoria melbourne

1147
00:44:52,390 --> 00:44:49,760
wednesday

1148
00:44:54,309 --> 00:44:52,400
in a lonely paddock at diggers rest

1149
00:44:57,829 --> 00:44:54,319
barely 30 miles from melbourne

1150
00:44:59,190 --> 00:44:57,839
two men are learning to fly they are mr

1151
00:45:02,230 --> 00:44:59,200
harry houdini

1152
00:45:03,430 --> 00:45:02,240
and mr rolf c banks side by side in the

1153
00:45:05,750 --> 00:45:03,440
paddocks stand

1154
00:45:07,270 --> 00:45:05,760
two large tents which house mr houdini's

1155
00:45:09,510 --> 00:45:07,280
bison biplane

1156
00:45:11,589 --> 00:45:09,520
and the right aeroplane which was

1157
00:45:13,589 --> 00:45:11,599
recently imported to australia

1158
00:45:15,349 --> 00:45:13,599
and has been placed in charge of mr

1159
00:45:18,150 --> 00:45:15,359
banks mr houdini

1160
00:45:18,790 --> 00:45:18,160
is already well known to the public by

1161
00:45:23,270 --> 00:45:18,800
his

1162
00:45:26,550 --> 00:45:23,280
ambition is to be

1163
00:45:27,109 --> 00:45:26,560
master of air and aviation for a month

1164
00:45:28,790 --> 00:45:27,119
passed

1165
00:45:30,150 --> 00:45:28,800
he and banks have been waiting for a

1166
00:45:33,109 --> 00:45:30,160
favorable opportunity

1167
00:45:34,550 --> 00:45:33,119
of competing for the honor of the first

1168
00:45:37,109 --> 00:45:34,560
australian flight

1169
00:45:37,910 --> 00:45:37,119
the weissen biplane was purchased by mr

1170
00:45:41,829 --> 00:45:37,920
houdini

1171
00:45:42,630 --> 00:45:41,839
from meza's sanchez beza and edorado

1172
00:45:45,430 --> 00:45:42,640
bello

1173
00:45:46,309 --> 00:45:45,440
aviators who had flown this machine in

1174
00:45:49,510 --> 00:45:46,319
france

1175
00:45:50,309 --> 00:45:49,520
for a continuous period of 1 hour and 20

1176
00:45:53,030 --> 00:45:50,319
minutes

1177
00:45:53,910 --> 00:45:53,040
mr houdini has only made a few short

1178
00:45:57,430 --> 00:45:53,920
flights

1179
00:46:00,470 --> 00:45:57,440
he is in his own words only a fledgling

1180
00:46:02,790 --> 00:46:00,480
that is to say he has been instructed

1181
00:46:03,670 --> 00:46:02,800
in the handling of the machine and he

1182
00:46:06,950 --> 00:46:03,680
has flown

1183
00:46:07,510 --> 00:46:06,960
but needs practice for almost a month

1184
00:46:10,390 --> 00:46:07,520
passed

1185
00:46:12,390 --> 00:46:10,400
he has motored daily to the flying field

1186
00:46:13,190 --> 00:46:12,400
but only two or three times has the

1187
00:46:16,309 --> 00:46:13,200
weather allowed

1188
00:46:18,790 --> 00:46:16,319
even an attempt at flying to be made

1189
00:46:19,349 --> 00:46:18,800
the wilbur wright aeroplane on which mr

1190
00:46:20,950 --> 00:46:19,359
rolf

1191
00:46:23,910 --> 00:46:20,960
banks hopes to be the first in

1192
00:46:24,550 --> 00:46:23,920
australian flight is now slowly emerging

1193
00:46:26,790 --> 00:46:24,560
from the

1194
00:46:28,390 --> 00:46:26,800
shapeless and battered condition in

1195
00:46:31,910 --> 00:46:28,400
which it was left by

1196
00:46:32,870 --> 00:46:31,920
an accident on march 1. and now we come

1197
00:46:36,870 --> 00:46:32,880
to a report

1198
00:46:39,829 --> 00:46:36,880
on friday the 18th of march 1910 in the

1199
00:46:41,190 --> 00:46:39,839
barrier minor which is from broken hill

1200
00:46:44,950 --> 00:46:41,200
new south wales

1201
00:46:48,150 --> 00:46:44,960
successful biplane flights melbourne

1202
00:46:50,230 --> 00:46:48,160
friday houdini the handcuff king

1203
00:46:52,309 --> 00:46:50,240
made three successful flights in a

1204
00:46:53,109 --> 00:46:52,319
biplane in a paddock at diggers rest

1205
00:46:56,710 --> 00:46:53,119
today

1206
00:46:58,550 --> 00:46:56,720
he circled three miles in four minutes

1207
00:46:59,910 --> 00:46:58,560
and more reports come to us from the

1208
00:47:03,030 --> 00:46:59,920
brisbane courier

1209
00:47:06,150 --> 00:47:03,040
dated the 22nd of march 1910 flying

1210
00:47:09,190 --> 00:47:06,160
in australia harry houdini's attempted

1211
00:47:11,829 --> 00:47:09,200
aviation have been crowned with success

1212
00:47:13,589 --> 00:47:11,839
says a melbourne message on friday last

1213
00:47:15,750 --> 00:47:13,599
after a month of patient waiting

1214
00:47:16,870 --> 00:47:15,760
with only three or four opportunities

1215
00:47:19,270 --> 00:47:16,880
for attempt

1216
00:47:20,710 --> 00:47:19,280
houdini made three successful flights at

1217
00:47:22,870 --> 00:47:20,720
diggers race this morning

1218
00:47:23,990 --> 00:47:22,880
the performance was witnessed by nine

1219
00:47:26,710 --> 00:47:24,000
people the

1220
00:47:27,109 --> 00:47:26,720
on weissen biplane was taken out of its

1221
00:47:29,750 --> 00:47:27,119
tent

1222
00:47:31,589 --> 00:47:29,760
shortly before eight o'clock the weather

1223
00:47:34,630 --> 00:47:31,599
was more propatorious

1224
00:47:37,990 --> 00:47:34,640
than he had experienced since he

1225
00:47:39,109 --> 00:47:38,000
installed the machine in its quarters at

1226
00:47:41,670 --> 00:47:39,119
diggers rest

1227
00:47:43,349 --> 00:47:41,680
a month ago and i just paused here to

1228
00:47:45,589 --> 00:47:43,359
remind you that sometimes

1229
00:47:47,270 --> 00:47:45,599
it's hard to read the reproduction here

1230
00:47:49,910 --> 00:47:47,280
of the newspapers from all those years

1231
00:47:53,510 --> 00:47:49,920
ago that can be a bit blurry

1232
00:47:57,670 --> 00:47:53,520
so we read on then houdini took the seat

1233
00:48:02,230 --> 00:48:01,030
went the propeller as it bit madly

1234
00:48:04,150 --> 00:48:02,240
through the air

1235
00:48:05,349 --> 00:48:04,160
a quick touch by the aviator to the

1236
00:48:08,549 --> 00:48:05,359
engine clutch

1237
00:48:12,390 --> 00:48:08,559
and his side set the

1238
00:48:15,190 --> 00:48:12,400
machine rolling and houdini was off

1239
00:48:16,549 --> 00:48:15,200
at a speed which quickly rose to over 30

1240
00:48:19,670 --> 00:48:16,559
miles an hour

1241
00:48:20,390 --> 00:48:19,680
when he had traveled about 40 or 50

1242
00:48:23,109 --> 00:48:20,400
yards

1243
00:48:23,990 --> 00:48:23,119
he raised the elevating planes and the

1244
00:48:27,750 --> 00:48:24,000
great machine

1245
00:48:30,870 --> 00:48:27,760
leapt into the air as birds spring

1246
00:48:33,030 --> 00:48:30,880
into the night he was only trying his

1247
00:48:35,349 --> 00:48:33,040
wings and went to no great height

1248
00:48:36,390 --> 00:48:35,359
sweeping around in a comparatively

1249
00:48:38,710 --> 00:48:36,400
narrow circle

1250
00:48:41,270 --> 00:48:38,720
he was back to earth within a minute

1251
00:48:44,870 --> 00:48:41,280
houdini bought the biplane to the ground

1252
00:48:46,150 --> 00:48:44,880
with scarcely ajar the second flight was

1253
00:48:48,230 --> 00:48:46,160
made with a

1254
00:48:49,510 --> 00:48:48,240
confidence heightened by the first

1255
00:48:52,710 --> 00:48:49,520
success

1256
00:48:53,510 --> 00:48:52,720
the birdman made a complete detour of

1257
00:48:55,990 --> 00:48:53,520
the paddock

1258
00:48:57,430 --> 00:48:56,000
covering between one and two miles in

1259
00:49:00,309 --> 00:48:57,440
his flight

1260
00:49:01,190 --> 00:49:00,319
as before he came down in an easy

1261
00:49:03,750 --> 00:49:01,200
graceful

1262
00:49:04,950 --> 00:49:03,760
fashion the third flight lasted three

1263
00:49:07,430 --> 00:49:04,960
and a half minutes

1264
00:49:08,309 --> 00:49:07,440
houdini swept boldly away from the

1265
00:49:11,270 --> 00:49:08,319
flying field

1266
00:49:13,829 --> 00:49:11,280
confident of his control of the plane

1267
00:49:14,790 --> 00:49:13,839
and passing over rocky rises and stone

1268
00:49:17,670 --> 00:49:14,800
fences

1269
00:49:18,069 --> 00:49:17,680
described a great circle which was at

1270
00:49:21,829 --> 00:49:18,079
the

1271
00:49:23,750 --> 00:49:21,839
lowest estimated well over two miles

1272
00:49:25,270 --> 00:49:23,760
the descent was faultless and the plane

1273
00:49:28,710 --> 00:49:25,280
came within 20 feet

1274
00:49:31,829 --> 00:49:28,720
of the starting point where the little

1275
00:49:34,630 --> 00:49:31,839
knot of witnesses was standing

1276
00:49:37,109 --> 00:49:34,640
the greatest altitude set down by the

1277
00:49:39,510 --> 00:49:37,119
witnesses was over 100 feet

1278
00:49:42,030 --> 00:49:39,520
on his return to melbourne by motorcar

1279
00:49:44,950 --> 00:49:42,040
houdini talked of his flights

1280
00:49:47,510 --> 00:49:44,960
unaffectedly but with the elation of the

1281
00:49:48,630 --> 00:49:47,520
successful entertainment yes i've done

1282
00:49:50,069 --> 00:49:48,640
it he said

1283
00:49:51,910 --> 00:49:50,079
when i went up for the first time i

1284
00:49:55,349 --> 00:49:51,920
thought for a minute that i was

1285
00:49:58,790 --> 00:49:55,359
in a tree then i know i was flying

1286
00:50:00,790 --> 00:49:58,800
and oddly enough that story doesn't seem

1287
00:50:02,710 --> 00:50:00,800
to be continued on the page as far as i

1288
00:50:06,710 --> 00:50:02,720
can see but that's okay i think we got

1289
00:50:08,549 --> 00:50:06,720
uh most of the report

1290
00:50:09,750 --> 00:50:08,559
and here we have the next report this

1291
00:50:13,270 --> 00:50:09,760
one's from the singleton

1292
00:50:17,349 --> 00:50:13,280
argus dated the 3rd of may

1293
00:50:20,630 --> 00:50:17,359
1910 houdini in the air

1294
00:50:21,589 --> 00:50:20,640
record flight at rose hill houdini the

1295
00:50:23,990 --> 00:50:21,599
handcuffed king

1296
00:50:25,990 --> 00:50:24,000
made a record flight in his aeroplane at

1297
00:50:28,549 --> 00:50:26,000
rose hill park racecourse

1298
00:50:29,589 --> 00:50:28,559
on sunday a crowd of several hundreds

1299
00:50:32,150 --> 00:50:29,599
had gathered

1300
00:50:33,990 --> 00:50:32,160
and shortly after half past 12 they were

1301
00:50:35,030 --> 00:50:34,000
rewarded for their patience with the

1302
00:50:37,349 --> 00:50:35,040
sight of a

1303
00:50:39,190 --> 00:50:37,359
weird-looking machine circling

1304
00:50:43,109 --> 00:50:39,200
gracefully around the track

1305
00:50:46,150 --> 00:50:43,119
at a height of nearly 150 feet

1306
00:50:49,670 --> 00:50:46,160
and as a quick aside rose hill

1307
00:50:51,670 --> 00:50:49,680
race track is in sydney houdini made

1308
00:50:53,030 --> 00:50:51,680
a successful start and he's playing

1309
00:50:56,470 --> 00:50:53,040
driven by a powerful

1310
00:51:00,470 --> 00:50:56,480
6080 hp env

1311
00:51:03,270 --> 00:51:00,480
motor leapt to a height of about 20 feet

1312
00:51:04,150 --> 00:51:03,280
it then dipped and rushed towards the

1313
00:51:07,589 --> 00:51:04,160
ground

1314
00:51:10,150 --> 00:51:07,599
at a rate bordering on 40 miles an hour

1315
00:51:12,630 --> 00:51:10,160
the public gasped while a number of

1316
00:51:13,510 --> 00:51:12,640
women screamed for it seemed as if the

1317
00:51:16,470 --> 00:51:13,520
aviator

1318
00:51:16,870 --> 00:51:16,480
were rushing to certain destruction a

1319
00:51:19,349 --> 00:51:16,880
neat

1320
00:51:20,150 --> 00:51:19,359
turn of the lever controlling the planes

1321
00:51:23,190 --> 00:51:20,160
however

1322
00:51:23,990 --> 00:51:23,200
altered its direction to a nicety and

1323
00:51:26,790 --> 00:51:24,000
the machine

1324
00:51:28,870 --> 00:51:26,800
soared gracefully skyward until an

1325
00:51:31,829 --> 00:51:28,880
altitude of 150 feet was

1326
00:51:32,470 --> 00:51:31,839
reached but his difficulties were not

1327
00:51:35,430 --> 00:51:32,480
over

1328
00:51:36,390 --> 00:51:35,440
the machine rose until at a height of

1329
00:51:39,349 --> 00:51:36,400
200

1330
00:51:40,630 --> 00:51:39,359
feet it turned and met the wind full in

1331
00:51:43,030 --> 00:51:40,640
the face

1332
00:51:43,910 --> 00:51:43,040
equivalent fell swiftly towards the

1333
00:51:46,950 --> 00:51:43,920
ground

1334
00:51:49,109 --> 00:51:46,960
as the engines had stopped it looked as

1335
00:51:51,990 --> 00:51:49,119
if houdini's last moment had come

1336
00:51:52,710 --> 00:51:52,000
the crowd was dumbfounded but when only

1337
00:51:55,589 --> 00:51:52,720
a few

1338
00:51:57,829 --> 00:51:55,599
feet from the ground the plucky aviator

1339
00:52:00,950 --> 00:51:57,839
managed to start his engines again

1340
00:52:03,430 --> 00:52:00,960
and the plane rose once more houdini

1341
00:52:05,109 --> 00:52:03,440
then circled around the racetrack twice

1342
00:52:06,069 --> 00:52:05,119
finishing up by sailing over the

1343
00:52:08,630 --> 00:52:06,079
grandstand

1344
00:52:10,390 --> 00:52:08,640
and dipping easily to the ground on the

1345
00:52:12,870 --> 00:52:10,400
opposite side

1346
00:52:14,870 --> 00:52:12,880
it was a splendid flight a better

1347
00:52:16,710 --> 00:52:14,880
demonstration of modern aeronautics

1348
00:52:19,270 --> 00:52:16,720
could not have been provided

1349
00:52:21,589 --> 00:52:19,280
and the public cheered heartily many

1350
00:52:24,870 --> 00:52:21,599
rushing to seize houdini by the hand

1351
00:52:25,270 --> 00:52:24,880
when he reached the earth that's my 14th

1352
00:52:27,750 --> 00:52:25,280
fly

1353
00:52:28,549 --> 00:52:27,760
in australia houdini remarked as he

1354
00:52:31,510 --> 00:52:28,559
landed

1355
00:52:32,069 --> 00:52:31,520
and i am satisfied he was carried

1356
00:52:34,790 --> 00:52:32,079
shoulder

1357
00:52:35,510 --> 00:52:34,800
high by the excited crowd the machine

1358
00:52:38,710 --> 00:52:35,520
which was

1359
00:52:42,150 --> 00:52:38,720
practically uninjured accepting a

1360
00:52:44,549 --> 00:52:42,160
slight bent tube is now to be dismantled

1361
00:52:47,750 --> 00:52:44,559
as houdini is taking it with him

1362
00:52:49,349 --> 00:52:47,760
to america it would be hard to imagine

1363
00:52:51,270 --> 00:52:49,359
if you were living in that day and age a

1364
00:52:54,309 --> 00:52:51,280
more exciting spectacle

1365
00:52:56,870 --> 00:52:54,319
and carried off by such a well-known

1366
00:53:00,549 --> 00:52:56,880
performer as harry houdini

1367
00:53:03,670 --> 00:53:00,559
now let's skip forward 16 years

1368
00:53:07,030 --> 00:53:03,680
and a report in the week from brisbane

1369
00:53:10,790 --> 00:53:07,040
published on the 5th of november 1926

1370
00:53:12,950 --> 00:53:10,800
harry houdini new york october 31

1371
00:53:13,990 --> 00:53:12,960
a message from detroit says that harry

1372
00:53:17,109 --> 00:53:14,000
houdini

1373
00:53:20,390 --> 00:53:17,119
the world's famous magician is dead

1374
00:53:21,510 --> 00:53:20,400
aged 52. harry houdini the famous

1375
00:53:25,150 --> 00:53:21,520
magician was born

1376
00:53:27,670 --> 00:53:25,160
at appleton wisconsin on april 6

1377
00:53:30,710 --> 00:53:27,680
1874

1378
00:53:31,670 --> 00:53:30,720
and as an aside i'll say he really was

1379
00:53:34,950 --> 00:53:31,680
born in

1380
00:53:36,470 --> 00:53:34,960
hungary but uh liked to

1381
00:53:38,950 --> 00:53:36,480
put it out there that he was really born

1382
00:53:42,710 --> 00:53:38,960
in america he was the son

1383
00:53:45,190 --> 00:53:42,720
of reverend dr mayer samuel vice

1384
00:53:47,910 --> 00:53:45,200
but changed his name to houdini he began

1385
00:53:51,190 --> 00:53:47,920
his career as a trapeze performer

1386
00:53:51,910 --> 00:53:51,200
in 1882 and made several tours of the

1387
00:53:54,230 --> 00:53:51,920
world

1388
00:53:55,349 --> 00:53:54,240
performing before many rulers and

1389
00:53:58,150 --> 00:53:55,359
notables

1390
00:53:58,950 --> 00:53:58,160
his main accomplishments were breaking

1391
00:54:02,470 --> 00:53:58,960
out of

1392
00:54:05,270 --> 00:54:02,480
jail cells chains manacles and sealed

1393
00:54:06,390 --> 00:54:05,280
boxes in which he was thrown into the

1394
00:54:09,829 --> 00:54:06,400
water

1395
00:54:10,870 --> 00:54:09,839
when in australia in 1910 in addition to

1396
00:54:13,910 --> 00:54:10,880
escaping from

1397
00:54:17,349 --> 00:54:13,920
the yarra into which he was thrown

1398
00:54:18,950 --> 00:54:17,359
manacled from princess bridge he tried

1399
00:54:20,870 --> 00:54:18,960
his hand at flying

1400
00:54:23,109 --> 00:54:20,880
he claimed to have been the first

1401
00:54:26,069 --> 00:54:23,119
successful fly in australia

1402
00:54:28,790 --> 00:54:26,079
and the american who's who records that

1403
00:54:31,750 --> 00:54:28,800
he was awarded a prize by the australian

1404
00:54:32,549 --> 00:54:31,760
aeronautical society for his feet

1405
00:54:34,790 --> 00:54:32,559
houdini

1406
00:54:35,990 --> 00:54:34,800
who has written many books on the

1407
00:54:37,910 --> 00:54:36,000
magician's art

1408
00:54:39,670 --> 00:54:37,920
has appeared in a number of moving

1409
00:54:42,789 --> 00:54:39,680
pictures of the

1410
00:54:45,910 --> 00:54:42,799
thriller type he was known as the man

1411
00:54:47,990 --> 00:54:45,920
who mystified the world

1412
00:54:51,990 --> 00:54:48,000
and on saturday the 27th of november

1413
00:54:55,349 --> 00:54:52,000
1926 from the evening news rockhampton

1414
00:54:58,870 --> 00:54:55,359
messages from houdini claims

1415
00:54:59,589 --> 00:54:58,880
by spiritual mediums australian cable

1416
00:55:02,870 --> 00:54:59,599
servers

1417
00:55:05,109 --> 00:55:02,880
new york 25th november 1926

1418
00:55:06,549 --> 00:55:05,119
dozens of mediums claimed to have

1419
00:55:09,190 --> 00:55:06,559
received a message from

1420
00:55:10,549 --> 00:55:09,200
houdini but the magician's widow says

1421
00:55:13,670 --> 00:55:10,559
that none

1422
00:55:16,470 --> 00:55:13,680
contains the key note of words agreed

1423
00:55:17,109 --> 00:55:16,480
upon before his death the widow revealed

1424
00:55:18,870 --> 00:55:17,119
today

1425
00:55:20,710 --> 00:55:18,880
that her husband made a compact to

1426
00:55:23,270 --> 00:55:20,720
communicate if possible

1427
00:55:25,829 --> 00:55:23,280
after death with her sir conan a doyle

1428
00:55:28,470 --> 00:55:25,839
and an unknown friend in philadelphia

1429
00:55:28,870 --> 00:55:28,480
houdini gave his wife a 10 word message

1430
00:55:31,670 --> 00:55:28,880
which

1431
00:55:32,309 --> 00:55:31,680
she is keeping secret the scientific

1432
00:55:35,510 --> 00:55:32,319
american

1433
00:55:38,150 --> 00:55:35,520
published a message as a communication

1434
00:55:40,950 --> 00:55:38,160
from houdini by a medium at brattleboro

1435
00:55:42,710 --> 00:55:40,960
massachusetts but the widow says he did

1436
00:55:44,630 --> 00:55:42,720
not have the right words

1437
00:55:48,470 --> 00:55:44,640
and finally let's wrap this up with a

1438
00:55:50,950 --> 00:55:48,480
report from 1947 the

1439
00:55:53,349 --> 00:55:50,960
truth magazine published in brisbane on

1440
00:55:57,670 --> 00:55:53,359
the 2nd of november

1441
00:56:00,710 --> 00:55:57,680
not one word from dead harry houdini

1442
00:56:02,950 --> 00:56:00,720
new york saturday seven men waited in

1443
00:56:04,230 --> 00:56:02,960
vain last night for some sign from the

1444
00:56:07,109 --> 00:56:04,240
departed spirit

1445
00:56:08,230 --> 00:56:07,119
of the world famous escapologist harry

1446
00:56:11,430 --> 00:56:08,240
houdini

1447
00:56:12,710 --> 00:56:11,440
halloween night was the 20th anniversary

1448
00:56:16,150 --> 00:56:12,720
of his death

1449
00:56:18,309 --> 00:56:16,160
but houdini didn't come through

1450
00:56:20,950 --> 00:56:18,319
before he died houdini promised that he

1451
00:56:21,910 --> 00:56:20,960
would attempt to return his spirit to

1452
00:56:24,789 --> 00:56:21,920
earth

1453
00:56:26,069 --> 00:56:24,799
so last night a group of seven men

1454
00:56:29,430 --> 00:56:26,079
members of the

1455
00:56:31,430 --> 00:56:29,440
waiting for houdini committee waited in

1456
00:56:32,870 --> 00:56:31,440
a dark room to see if the greatest

1457
00:56:35,430 --> 00:56:32,880
magician of them all

1458
00:56:37,430 --> 00:56:35,440
could keep his promise it was agreed

1459
00:56:39,990 --> 00:56:37,440
that the supreme test would be

1460
00:56:41,270 --> 00:56:40,000
accomplished if the spirit of houdini

1461
00:56:44,150 --> 00:56:41,280
could inscribe

1462
00:56:45,270 --> 00:56:44,160
ten words which had been given to joseph

1463
00:56:47,910 --> 00:56:45,280
dunninger

1464
00:56:48,950 --> 00:56:47,920
chairman of the committee before houdini

1465
00:56:52,069 --> 00:56:48,960
died

1466
00:56:53,990 --> 00:56:52,079
last night the group headed by duninger

1467
00:56:55,270 --> 00:56:54,000
sat in total darkness in dunning's

1468
00:56:57,190 --> 00:56:55,280
office while

1469
00:56:58,870 --> 00:56:57,200
the medium attempted to contact the

1470
00:57:01,349 --> 00:56:58,880
spirit of houdini

1471
00:57:02,470 --> 00:57:01,359
the seance began at midnight and was

1472
00:57:06,230 --> 00:57:02,480
abandoned

1473
00:57:09,510 --> 00:57:06,240
15 minutes later afterwards dunninger

1474
00:57:12,230 --> 00:57:09,520
reported that the sensitive buzzer

1475
00:57:13,589 --> 00:57:12,240
set up to receive sensitive vibrations

1476
00:57:16,390 --> 00:57:13,599
had not buzzed

1477
00:57:17,109 --> 00:57:16,400
nor had there been any movement of the

1478
00:57:20,549 --> 00:57:17,119
delicate

1479
00:57:21,270 --> 00:57:20,559
scale on a glass dome a scale that could

1480
00:57:24,309 --> 00:57:21,280
be moved

1481
00:57:26,870 --> 00:57:24,319
only by a spirit hand

1482
00:57:28,309 --> 00:57:26,880
in fact nothing happened except the

1483
00:57:30,150 --> 00:57:28,319
ringing of a phone

1484
00:57:31,750 --> 00:57:30,160
the group was startled when the phone

1485
00:57:34,630 --> 00:57:31,760
caller said

1486
00:57:36,230 --> 00:57:34,640
this is harry but it turned out to be a

1487
00:57:39,109 --> 00:57:36,240
prankster who had heard

1488
00:57:39,750 --> 00:57:39,119
of the seance houdini gave dungener ten

1489
00:57:42,710 --> 00:57:39,760
words

1490
00:57:43,630 --> 00:57:42,720
before he died in detroit on halloween

1491
00:57:46,309 --> 00:57:43,640
night in

1492
00:57:48,309 --> 00:57:46,319
1927. at the same time he was

1493
00:57:49,030 --> 00:57:48,319
demonstrating his perfect physical

1494
00:57:50,870 --> 00:57:49,040
condition

1495
00:57:52,950 --> 00:57:50,880
and invited a friend to punch him on the

1496
00:57:55,510 --> 00:57:52,960
chest the friend complied

1497
00:57:57,190 --> 00:57:55,520
with the request and houdini died a

1498
00:57:59,750 --> 00:57:57,200
short time afterwards

1499
00:58:01,910 --> 00:57:59,760
for 18 years his widow had also waited

1500
00:58:09,660 --> 00:58:01,920
for a message from her departed husband

1501
00:58:12,870 --> 00:58:09,670
without success she died two years ago

1502
00:58:16,069 --> 00:58:12,880
[Music]

1503
00:58:19,109 --> 00:58:16,079
and there we have it a scant

1504
00:58:20,150 --> 00:58:19,119
few of the many many reports about harry

1505
00:58:22,630 --> 00:58:20,160
houdini

1506
00:58:23,910 --> 00:58:22,640
published in australia throughout the uh

1507
00:58:27,910 --> 00:58:23,920
the decades

1508
00:58:30,309 --> 00:58:27,920
of the 20th century and the more i do

1509
00:58:32,630 --> 00:58:30,319
this uh segment on drove and read about

1510
00:58:34,470 --> 00:58:32,640
fantastic reports from the past

1511
00:58:36,309 --> 00:58:34,480
the more i wish i could see these but

1512
00:58:37,670 --> 00:58:36,319
you can see

1513
00:58:39,990 --> 00:58:37,680
and i will link to this in the show

1514
00:58:40,549 --> 00:58:40,000
notes you can see a movie made at the

1515
00:58:43,030 --> 00:58:40,559
time

1516
00:58:45,430 --> 00:58:43,040
of harry houdini flying at diggers rest

1517
00:58:49,589 --> 00:58:45,440
in australia

1518
00:58:53,270 --> 00:58:51,430
known to millions of theatergoers the

1519
00:58:55,430 --> 00:58:53,280
world over for his amazing and

1520
00:58:56,309 --> 00:58:55,440
spectacular feats of magic and physical

1521
00:58:58,950 --> 00:58:56,319
skill

1522
00:59:01,030 --> 00:58:58,960
harry houdini famous star is pictured

1523
00:59:03,270 --> 00:59:01,040
here as he adds another chapter to his

1524
00:59:05,510 --> 00:59:03,280
accomplishments of daring

1525
00:59:07,030 --> 00:59:05,520
in those days when an aviator kissed his

1526
00:59:10,710 --> 00:59:07,040
wife goodbye

1527
00:59:18,390 --> 00:59:10,720
it was no idle gesture houdini had to be

1528
00:59:20,870 --> 00:59:18,400
a wizard to get out of this thing alive

1529
00:59:22,549 --> 00:59:20,880
he's out on the first successful hop

1530
00:59:24,069 --> 00:59:22,559
ever made in australia

1531
00:59:26,309 --> 00:59:24,079
it was only a two and a half minute

1532
00:59:28,390 --> 00:59:26,319
flight but it established a record

1533
00:59:32,150 --> 00:59:28,400
and earned houdini a permanent place in

1534
00:59:34,549 --> 00:59:32,160
aviation history

1535
00:59:35,780 --> 00:59:34,559
houdini one of the great showmen of the

1536
00:59:40,230 --> 00:59:35,790
20th century

1537
00:59:45,270 --> 00:59:42,150
and those reports come to us again from

1538
01:00:06,069 --> 00:59:45,280
trove trove.nla.gov

1539
01:00:09,349 --> 01:00:07,670
thank you for listening to the skeptic

1540
01:00:11,349 --> 01:00:09,359
zone and thank you very much to dr

1541
01:00:13,349 --> 01:00:11,359
shivano sutherland for taking time out

1542
01:00:16,230 --> 01:00:13,359
to chat with me

1543
01:00:18,230 --> 01:00:16,240
and mr tom toms the cat who was uh very

1544
01:00:19,190 --> 01:00:18,240
curious to see all the equipment set up

1545
01:00:26,870 --> 01:00:19,200
in

1546
01:00:29,270 --> 01:00:26,880
very nice mr tom toms and further to our

1547
01:00:31,109 --> 01:00:29,280
conversation about using

1548
01:00:33,750 --> 01:00:31,119
so-called alternative or complementary

1549
01:00:36,470 --> 01:00:33,760
medicines at the chris o'brien

1550
01:00:38,549 --> 01:00:36,480
life house it's yeah it's a tricky one

1551
01:00:39,990 --> 01:00:38,559
because obviously from my point of view

1552
01:00:43,670 --> 01:00:40,000
and probably from

1553
01:00:47,270 --> 01:00:43,680
many of your points of view things like

1554
01:00:49,910 --> 01:00:47,280
acupuncture and reflexology and so on

1555
01:00:51,910 --> 01:00:49,920
um well it's pretty well understood that

1556
01:00:53,990 --> 01:00:51,920
they don't work and the mechanism behind

1557
01:00:55,670 --> 01:00:54,000
them doesn't work and can't work

1558
01:00:58,309 --> 01:00:55,680
but then again you know sometimes you're

1559
01:01:00,230 --> 01:00:58,319
in the situation of

1560
01:01:01,910 --> 01:01:00,240
uh picking your battles and not being

1561
01:01:05,430 --> 01:01:01,920
too critical of

1562
01:01:06,549 --> 01:01:05,440
uh men and women undergoing cancer

1563
01:01:10,309 --> 01:01:06,559
therapies and

1564
01:01:13,510 --> 01:01:10,319
life-threatening situations anyway

1565
01:01:16,150 --> 01:01:13,520
be that as it may it's just not uh all

1566
01:01:18,230 --> 01:01:16,160
black and white is it i'm sure you have

1567
01:01:19,910 --> 01:01:18,240
your own thoughts and opinions on that

1568
01:01:21,750 --> 01:01:19,920
thank you to those people who continue

1569
01:01:24,230 --> 01:01:21,760
to support the skeptic zone at patreon

1570
01:01:25,990 --> 01:01:24,240
or paypal at skepticzone.tv

1571
01:01:28,549 --> 01:01:26,000
and those people who've recently come on

1572
01:01:29,510 --> 01:01:28,559
board and also i'm delighted to say i've

1573
01:01:32,230 --> 01:01:29,520
uh

1574
01:01:34,230 --> 01:01:32,240
sold one of the photographs that i have

1575
01:01:36,390 --> 01:01:34,240
for sale at skepticzone.tv

1576
01:01:37,990 --> 01:01:36,400
scroll to the bottom of the page and

1577
01:01:40,630 --> 01:01:38,000
you'll see a gallery of

1578
01:01:42,549 --> 01:01:40,640
photographs some are free i've got four

1579
01:01:43,430 --> 01:01:42,559
free ones which are up on wiki actually

1580
01:01:46,950 --> 01:01:43,440
you can have and

1581
01:01:47,430 --> 01:01:46,960
print out and enjoy and there are many

1582
01:01:50,789 --> 01:01:47,440
more

1583
01:01:53,109 --> 01:01:50,799
almost 50 ones available on the store

1584
01:01:53,910 --> 01:01:53,119
if you click the link there have a look

1585
01:01:58,069 --> 01:01:53,920
you might

1586
01:01:58,630 --> 01:01:58,079
next week's show it's a bit of a mystery

1587
01:02:00,390 --> 01:01:58,640
to me

1588
01:02:02,230 --> 01:02:00,400
because for the first time in a long

1589
01:02:03,109 --> 01:02:02,240
time i haven't got things sort of lined

1590
01:02:05,750 --> 01:02:03,119
up

1591
01:02:06,630 --> 01:02:05,760
ahead of time hmm so it's a bit of a

1592
01:02:08,789 --> 01:02:06,640
mystery

1593
01:02:09,910 --> 01:02:08,799
but i can tell you what i am doing on

1594
01:02:12,870 --> 01:02:09,920
friday night

1595
01:02:14,150 --> 01:02:12,880
here in sydney australia australian time

1596
01:02:16,069 --> 01:02:14,160
australian eastern time

1597
01:02:18,150 --> 01:02:16,079
or is at least in daylight time whatever

1598
01:02:20,789 --> 01:02:18,160
time 8 30

1599
01:02:21,589 --> 01:02:20,799
i am taking part in maynard's live

1600
01:02:23,829 --> 01:02:21,599
facebook

1601
01:02:26,470 --> 01:02:23,839
quiz and i'll link to that in this

1602
01:02:29,990 --> 01:02:26,480
week's show notes so if you're around

1603
01:02:31,510 --> 01:02:30,000
on friday evening about 8 30 tune in to

1604
01:02:34,710 --> 01:02:31,520
facebook

1605
01:02:35,589 --> 01:02:34,720
and enjoy maynard's quiz with me in the

1606
01:02:38,150 --> 01:02:35,599
background

1607
01:02:40,230 --> 01:02:38,160
and it's all live and interactive but as

1608
01:02:42,309 --> 01:02:40,240
always you can go to maynard.com and

1609
01:02:45,109 --> 01:02:42,319
check out maynard's range of

1610
01:02:46,230 --> 01:02:45,119
wackiness and podcasts and all sorts of

1611
01:02:48,150 --> 01:02:46,240
things

1612
01:02:49,750 --> 01:02:48,160
and before i go a big thank you to all

1613
01:02:50,950 --> 01:02:49,760
the people who have contributed to the

1614
01:02:53,549 --> 01:02:50,960
skeptic zone

1615
01:02:54,950 --> 01:02:53,559
over the years to help me reach number

1616
01:02:56,309 --> 01:02:54,960
650

1617
01:02:58,710 --> 01:02:56,319
and a big hello to our latest

1618
01:03:00,230 --> 01:02:58,720
correspondent adrian hill

1619
01:03:02,390 --> 01:03:00,240
all the way over there in canada i used

1620
01:03:03,270 --> 01:03:02,400
to live in canada some of you probably

1621
01:03:07,109 --> 01:03:03,280
know that

1622
01:03:10,870 --> 01:03:07,119
in 1968 1969 my

1623
01:03:12,390 --> 01:03:10,880
dad my dad the reverend r.h saunders was

1624
01:03:13,990 --> 01:03:12,400
posted to canada

1625
01:03:15,430 --> 01:03:14,000
and we ended up in the little town of

1626
01:03:18,470 --> 01:03:15,440
tribune in the

1627
01:03:21,270 --> 01:03:18,480
province of saskatchewan so

1628
01:03:23,510 --> 01:03:21,280
there's a little known fact yes and i

1629
01:03:24,150 --> 01:03:23,520
remember the snow being as high as the

1630
01:03:29,589 --> 01:03:24,160
house

1631
01:03:31,029 --> 01:03:29,599
big hello to adrian and a big thank you

1632
01:03:32,710 --> 01:03:31,039
to all those people out there

1633
01:03:34,309 --> 01:03:32,720
who have contributed to the show over

1634
01:03:36,230 --> 01:03:34,319
the years but for this week

1635
01:03:42,150 --> 01:03:36,240
this is richard saunders signing off

1636
01:03:45,349 --> 01:03:43,910
you've been listening to the skeptic

1637
01:03:48,589 --> 01:03:45,359
zone podcast

1638
01:03:49,910 --> 01:03:48,599
please visit our website at

1639
01:03:53,029 --> 01:03:49,920
www.skepticzone.tv

1640
01:03:55,029 --> 01:03:53,039
for show notes contacts and to access

1641
01:03:58,549 --> 01:03:55,039
the back catalog of episodes

1642
01:04:00,549 --> 01:03:58,559
going back to 2008. you can follow the

1643
01:04:04,069 --> 01:04:00,559
skeptic zone podcast on twitter

1644
01:04:07,589 --> 01:04:04,079
at skepticzone visit our facebook page

1645
01:04:08,950 --> 01:04:07,599
or leave a review on itunes you can also

1646
01:04:12,230 --> 01:04:08,960
support the skeptic zone

1647
01:04:12,950 --> 01:04:12,240
via patreon or paypal the skeptic zone

1648
01:04:15,829 --> 01:04:12,960
podcast

1649
01:04:17,670 --> 01:04:15,839
is an independent production the views

1650
01:04:18,069 --> 01:04:17,680
and opinions expressed on the skeptic

1651
01:04:20,069 --> 01:04:18,079
zone

1652
01:04:21,990 --> 01:04:20,079
are not necessarily those of australian

1653
01:04:35,270 --> 01:04:22,000
skeptics or any other

1654
01:04:39,430 --> 01:04:37,109
hello to the people who listened after

1655
01:04:43,190 --> 01:04:39,440
the music this week it's the dice game

1656
01:04:45,190 --> 01:04:43,200
with a d20 d20

1657
01:04:47,270 --> 01:04:45,200
where's my pencil here it is i'm

1658
01:04:49,829 --> 01:04:47,280
skeptical pencil right

1659
01:04:51,190 --> 01:04:49,839
bring my skeptics on notepad ready so

1660
01:04:53,430 --> 01:04:51,200
for those of you who don't know this is

1661
01:04:57,109 --> 01:04:53,440
the part of the show where we roll a

1662
01:04:59,670 --> 01:04:57,119
die three times something like that

1663
01:05:01,349 --> 01:04:59,680
and you uh use your mystical powers or

1664
01:05:02,710 --> 01:05:01,359
your dumb luck to guess what numbers

1665
01:05:06,150 --> 01:05:02,720
come up

1666
01:05:09,109 --> 01:05:06,160
and since it's a d20 you can have one

1667
01:05:11,190 --> 01:05:09,119
two three all the way up to 20.

1668
01:05:14,150 --> 01:05:11,200
here it goes in my dice rolling machine

1669
01:05:22,710 --> 01:05:17,510
18 18

1670
01:05:27,510 --> 01:05:22,720
okay next one coming up

1671
01:05:32,150 --> 01:05:27,520
14 and the last number

1672
01:05:37,029 --> 01:05:32,160
is three

1673
01:05:39,190 --> 01:05:37,039
and i'll swap dice

1674
01:05:40,470 --> 01:05:39,200
to a six-sided one this one's got aliens

1675
01:05:43,910 --> 01:05:40,480
on it i picked it up at

1676
01:05:46,710 --> 01:05:43,920
albuquerque airport here we go

1677
01:05:48,829 --> 01:05:46,720
last roll of the dice with six numbers

1678
01:05:51,829 --> 01:05:48,839
guess away

1679
01:05:56,069 --> 01:05:51,839
six today's winning numbers